PL9fwy3NUQKwZ52Wxrug71SHLnFjqhlVJc/ReZsY2VOIaY_raw.srt

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As-salamu alaykum. How are you? Good.

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So today, after listening to your reports, And

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we're planning to continue the debate we started

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last time. But this time, we are having a leader.

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So we are two leaders, me and Ms. Ahlam. We are

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going to debate. So she's going to choose a team

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or anybody who can go with her and come with me.

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And I ask you, if you remember last time, to

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search more. But before we start, I would be

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interested in listening to one report of yours.

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I want a different guess.

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Just come here, come here. Being absent for two

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sequential quarter lectures is something you can't

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describe, especially after your admiration to each

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word given in the class. Yeah, I was absent for

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two days and I didn't come to the university

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because of some syndromic circumstances. They told

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me about the collection of reports and the

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repetitive marks. Anyway, I watched the videos and

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they wrote my report, which is something necessary

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in my day. What happened in the last lecture

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remind me of what we did in Marlow and Relief, but

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now it is different. It's between two ideas or two

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themes in the same poem. We have to decide if this

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poem is about the industrial revolution or the

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poetic imagination. Two groups were debated and

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both of them gave good arguments and answers. For

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me, I really got confused. I am really confused

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that you can't say it is something for

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revolutionary poetry, because it's written in the

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revolution time. Ordinarily, the poem will

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represent the beginning of industrial revolution.

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However, when you see the words or the poems

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itself, you can, it comes to your mind that it is

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talks, it talks about the botic imagination. I

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really don't know, but for sure, after well

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analysis and my search and study, I will hopefully

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will reach the point. Thereafter, Dr. Habib shows

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some videos that describe how England was and how

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the industrial revolution changed everything, even

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the purity of countryside. Good, thank you very

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much. Yes, it seems like we succeeded in like

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buffling you because that was the intention, like

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to baffle you and to make you research more.

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Because yes, you don't know what is it about. So

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you have to research and to see what is it about.

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Okay, yes. Jihan, do you want to redeem yourself

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because you keep absent? And you don't like to see

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the surprises? Do you know what the surprise? It

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sounds like a bad one. No, no, no. Okay. Okay.

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It's a good one. You come here. Okay, this is more

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unbuffled as well. Tiger, tiger by Blake's hand In

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the night the eyes do stand Created by God burning

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bright And then by the poet another in sight

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Framed good and framed bad They say that's exactly

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industrial land But poetics I see a poet's stand

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So perplexing it may, it might Be this or that or

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a third invoked fright Well, good clap for her

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again. You know, she's hinting to the dilemma we

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have of interpretations. And today's class, as you

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know, the title of today's class, it is debating

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the different interpretations of Blake's The

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Tiger. So now, last time, we just tried like to to

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touch upon slightly two different interpretations.

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Like, the most prominent one is the one about,

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like, the tiger is about the industrial

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revolution. And the most intellectual one, you

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see, I would say, it is about the poetic

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imagination. It is about the artistic creation.

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So, like, we want to see you interacting today.

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And that's why we devised a new plan or a new

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strategy of having an experienced teacher with me.

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And we are debating. And of course, I'm debating

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today against my conviction, which is perhaps an

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art of debate. So I'd like people to come this

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side to share with Ms. Ahlam, who's ready.

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She's adopting the poetic creation. And we're

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going to have the poem, yes?

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Again, Khaled, we're going to have a debate, like

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last time. Okay, you just come here, okay? Please,

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anyone who wants to side with her, with them?

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Okay, let's see. This is like you come either

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side, here or there. So I'm afraid nobody is going

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to side with me. Okay, yes. You can have your,

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your bring, your bring chairs.

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We need the poem though.

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Okay, okay.

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We need like some people to come on my side. Yes,

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it's about industrial revolution.

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Okay, you want me to be alone?

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Okay, yes? Yes, Rwand? Now we are like the other

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Rwand. You see? Yes, do you want like? No, you

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just sit Rwand like. We don't have two Rwand. This

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will, okay.

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No, it's not there. We have it here. So, you need

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a mic? Khaled, do they have a mic? Just one mic?

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Okay.

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It's okay. So, and we have to vote who's winning.

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You know, like at the end, there will be a voting.

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What do you think? Like, is the tiger about poetic

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imagination, artistic imagination? Or is it about,

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you know, the Industrial Revolution? Okay. Shall

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we start by you? By your team? Yes.

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What do you think? Yes.

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All right, I think like the era before Blake, the

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poetry lacked imagination. They were too concerned

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about rationalism and reason and discussing these

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themes in their poetry. And then Blake was the pre

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-romantic, so he started, or he initiated by his

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works, the poetic imagination, a broader sense of

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thematic tacklement in his poetry. And here in the

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tiger, we saw a lot of indications, like hand,

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eye, frame, and then some oxymorons, and he's

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showing God's creation, but then he gave us, he

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framed it in a way to give us a deeper meaning, to

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see what's beyond this creation, to see like he

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reflected like the bad and the good, like he

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showed us a creation of art. And that's what I see

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like is very prominent about this poet, the poem

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in particular. Okay, thank you. Dewan, do you want

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to add anything? You just come closer here. Yes,

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do you want to respond to that? I think that

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William Blake is considered one of the romanticism

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poets and they were all concerned about

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criticizing the industrial revolution and all

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their poetry. So he's considered one of them. So

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he's also criticizing the industrial revolution.

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I think you know you might be true to some extent

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because what you said like has to do with the

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general you know things you are right it's about

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him it's not about the poem it's not about

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imagination but like Blake was interested you know

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in imagination because he was writing something

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against the expectation of his time But I think

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here in this poem, it is about industrial

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revolution. Like as you see, there are many

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references in the poem which assert the fact that

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it is about the industrial revolution. This

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meticulous process of designing, of framing the

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tiger seems to be like it is about industrial

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revolution.

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It's okay. Okay. So as you said, that the poem

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generally talks about a kind of revolution,

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whether it is a political revolution or a literary

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or again, a poetic revolution, we can consider

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both of them inside the poem here, The Tiger. So

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this is just as you said before that the poem is

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talking about the industrial revolution or the

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French or the American revolution, whatever

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revolution it is. So we can talk about revolutions

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in general. So you are giving me credit. Thank you

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very much. You are giving me credit. It's okay. So

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from what you have said, again, the Industrial

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Revolution, we can talk about the poetic

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revolution inside the poem itself. As Jihan

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mentioned before too, that the age before William

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Blake is the age of reason, as you know. It is the

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enlightenment period with all its, again, concerns

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about the human mind only without, you know, given

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any concern to his feelings, his emotions. I mean

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the internal side of the human being. They dealt

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with him as a kind of report or machine or

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something like that. But here we can take the

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tiger as the new creation of art. Okay, thank you

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very much, you know, it sounds interesting, but

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let us, you know, gently disagree with you. Okay.

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And I'm not sure like whether one of my team

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members is going to have, you know, yeah, this is

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the heart of debating, we have to disagree with

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each other. Actually, the poem is like describing

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process and like we all know that industrial

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revolution is concerned with the process like to

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to produce something. And in the tiger, it can be

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seen as it symbolized the industrial revolution by

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the process of its creation. Yeah, and I'm going

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to add to that that if you look here at this

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creation, it is a monster-like. It is a monster.

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It is like a monster. And what is more monstrous

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than the industrial revolution? So here, if you

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look at the tiger, It is, you know, very

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frightening. It is very horrifying. And yes, that

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was, I know some of you would say, what about, you

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know, like fearful symmetry? And like, yes, of

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course, the Industrial Revolution has its

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glimmering, shimmering aspect. But again, it is

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deep inside, it has corrupted, it corrupts the

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people, it has a moral corruption, social

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corruption. So I think this is not like an

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ordinary tiger. It is a mythical, it is a monster,

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and it reminds me of Chile, Frankenstein. You see

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what I mean? Yeah, that's it.

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Okay, I want to say from the poem itself, why he

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chose the tiger and the lamb. Might he mean the

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lamb in his earlier poem, which he read in the

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past? So in the line who he wrote the tiger, who

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wrote the lamb. So he might be referred to refer

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to the poet himself and be the following tiger

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which follow the poem The Lamb. So he exactly

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chose the lamb and the tiger to show that this is

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the... They are created by the same creator. Thank

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you very much. Yeah, what do you think? Actually,

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the lamb was like the songs of innocence and it

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was describing the childhood and the innocence of

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a child before they were corrupted as a grown-up

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or adult. I think the tiger is like contradictory

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to the lamb. As the child grows up, so he will be

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corrupted by the industrial revolution to forget

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what is the purpose of life, how he can be like

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the innocence and good in his heart. Like it would

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be replaced by evil and like determination for

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more products and for like materialism purposes

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mostly. And you want to add anything? As Rawan

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said, I agree with her that the tiger is about

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industrial revolution because the tiger has two

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things, the bad side and the good side. So it

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is... It applies to industrial revolution. Yeah,

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it has two sides.

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So the tiger has two sides, that she is very

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fearful, it's very beautiful, at the same time the

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industrial revolution maybe it destroys nature,

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destroys the countryside, but at the same time it

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has something useful, it has a lot of advantages.

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Let us stick to their main proposition, which says

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we have a difference between the tiger and the

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lamb. I think here the question is, the persona in

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the poem is exclaiming, is asking, because this is

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a monster. Did the one who created the lamb create

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thee? So it is surprising, because this is like a

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monster. Think of the other side.

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Is it a monastery for whom? Yes. The other

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question. So it is okay, we can agree that it is a

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monastery life, but it is a monastery for whom? Is

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it a monastery for the new romantic, the new

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period, or for the previous period? I mean before

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romanticism, the new classical. So this is another

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thing. So if we go again to the fearful symmetry.

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Symmetry, it is the shape of poetry. This is what

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we can consider here. But it is fearful. Fearful

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for whom? Is it fearful for, I mean, the new

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generation or the previous generation? So it might

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be fearful for them because it is a kind of a

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revolutionary one, a rebellious one. Since we can

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consider again William Drake as a rebel, as a

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revolutionary poet. So here we can go deeply again

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inside the poem itself and prove our stand here.

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So thank you. It's a strong proposition, you know,

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we have to respond. Yes. Also here, like the main

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00:17:28,170 --> 00:17:30,930
focus, if you see whether the lamp or the tiger,

249
00:17:31,150 --> 00:17:33,730
you see that the main focus, not only the thematic

250
00:17:33,730 --> 00:17:38,730
focus, but also the the stylistic focus is on

251
00:17:38,730 --> 00:17:41,670
creation. Like when you said, OK, there's the good

252
00:17:41,670 --> 00:17:44,510
side and the bad side. This is something like a

253
00:17:44,510 --> 00:17:48,380
like just a part of the theme and you related that

254
00:17:48,380 --> 00:17:52,540
to industrial revolution however if you think of

255
00:17:52,540 --> 00:17:55,680
poetic imagination it includes the theme it

256
00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,920
includes this style the references in the poem I

257
00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:02,600
do respect what you say guys but it seems like you

258
00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,540
are not looking closely at the poem you are not

259
00:18:05,540 --> 00:18:10,590
looking at the word frame and I think frame It has

260
00:18:10,590 --> 00:18:15,450
to do with artificial. We don't talk about

261
00:18:15,450 --> 00:18:20,990
imagination framing, but framing is

262
00:18:20,990 --> 00:18:23,330
more artificial. When we are talking about

263
00:18:23,330 --> 00:18:27,610
framing, it is more artificial. It is not the job

264
00:18:27,610 --> 00:18:32,970
of imagination. Imagination might have you know,

265
00:18:33,210 --> 00:18:36,930
more superior, but this has to do with framing.

266
00:18:37,490 --> 00:18:40,450
And again, we are talking about the whole creation

267
00:18:40,450 --> 00:18:43,730
as like if you see somebody is seizing the fire,

268
00:18:44,130 --> 00:18:48,210
is seizing the fire, braces, like the place, see?

269
00:18:48,450 --> 00:18:52,430
But the fire as a word is used so much actually by

270
00:18:52,430 --> 00:18:56,710
the romantics to mean something which is eternal.

271
00:18:57,340 --> 00:19:00,620
Something which is immortal. And immortality again

272
00:19:00,620 --> 00:19:03,480
is a key word in romanticism. Yeah, but again this

273
00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:07,460
is a satanic fire. It is a satanic fire. It is

274
00:19:07,460 --> 00:19:11,640
Satan burning bright, you know. It contradicts

275
00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,980
with the lamp. So how you can say that it is

276
00:19:13,980 --> 00:19:16,780
satanic and there is a mortal hand and yeah but

277
00:19:16,780 --> 00:19:19,500
look at what a dreaded hand what dreaded feet you

278
00:19:19,500 --> 00:19:23,700
know it is you know it is okay perplexing and it

279
00:19:23,700 --> 00:19:26,580
is actually horrifying for the I mean the previous

280
00:19:26,580 --> 00:19:30,280
generation yeah that's that so also you can see

281
00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:33,310
like you can take the fact that okay there is

282
00:19:33,310 --> 00:19:35,170
something about satanic there's something about

283
00:19:35,170 --> 00:19:37,790
really good and divine yeah but if you look at

284
00:19:37,790 --> 00:19:41,890
that made by the poet himself he managed to frame

285
00:19:41,890 --> 00:19:45,470
it in a way to show you the good and the bad so it

286
00:19:45,470 --> 00:19:48,810
it can be related to anything but if we look at

287
00:19:48,810 --> 00:19:51,570
the real life of the English people how it was

288
00:19:51,570 --> 00:19:55,660
transformed by that hideous Monster, I would say

289
00:19:55,660 --> 00:19:58,960
hideous monster because it transfigured the whole

290
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:03,680
life of the English people, like people where the

291
00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:06,720
life of the people was mechanical, you know, a lot

292
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:09,460
of people were abused, you know, women were abused

293
00:20:09,460 --> 00:20:11,640
in the factory. So don't you think this is

294
00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:17,890
satanic? No. It is symmetry, yes. It, you know,

295
00:20:17,970 --> 00:20:21,210
organized, it framed their life from the outside.

296
00:20:21,730 --> 00:20:26,110
They, you know, they were more urbanized. However,

297
00:20:26,710 --> 00:20:29,230
there was moral degradation. There, you know,

298
00:20:29,590 --> 00:20:32,770
there was like political degradation, social

299
00:20:32,770 --> 00:20:36,090
degradation. So we were talking about, you know, a

300
00:20:36,090 --> 00:20:39,270
relapse in human values. well how then do you

301
00:20:39,270 --> 00:20:42,650
explain all the words that refer to creation to

302
00:20:42,650 --> 00:20:46,110
change in the poetic sense of the age like the

303
00:20:46,110 --> 00:20:48,970
previous age used to have different style

304
00:20:48,970 --> 00:20:52,850
different words different references and here the

305
00:20:52,850 --> 00:20:56,590
focus seems to be on changing and shifting that

306
00:20:56,590 --> 00:21:00,250
shifting that style of writing into something more

307
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:02,580
Yeah, but look here, he's still using the heroic

308
00:21:02,580 --> 00:21:05,340
couplet, you know? So what shift you are taking?

309
00:21:05,500 --> 00:21:07,820
Nine and nine. That's why he's pre-romantic. No,

310
00:21:07,940 --> 00:21:10,220
this is not pre-romantic. No, heroic couplet,

311
00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:13,780
heroic couplet. Heroic couplet is Alexander Pope

312
00:21:13,780 --> 00:21:16,840
and John Drowden. So, you know, and this is, you

313
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:19,760
know, I think it is mechanical. So if we're

314
00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:20,540
talking about this,

315
00:21:26,170 --> 00:21:29,790
I agree with Dr. Akramdah that it is a mechanical

316
00:21:29,790 --> 00:21:33,150
revolution because he used, as he said, he used

317
00:21:33,150 --> 00:21:39,310
the same complex of the previous era. As a

318
00:21:39,310 --> 00:21:41,550
romantic for what he cannot get rid of actually

319
00:21:41,550 --> 00:21:43,770
all the styles of the previous era. If he wants to

320
00:21:43,770 --> 00:21:46,570
make a revolution, he has to. Even the heroic

321
00:21:46,570 --> 00:21:48,910
couplet, he managed to give it a different feel.

322
00:21:49,150 --> 00:21:51,790
No, but if he wants to make a new revolution, he

323
00:21:51,790 --> 00:21:55,770
has to change everything, to change everything in

324
00:21:55,770 --> 00:21:58,970
the poem. That to convince us about his idea,

325
00:21:59,110 --> 00:22:02,790
about his ideas. That's what they call step by

326
00:22:02,790 --> 00:22:05,650
step. Exactly, that's it. It's not one jump. It's

327
00:22:05,650 --> 00:22:11,080
not like... It is a revolution, so he has to...

328
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:15,220
No, it's okay, we can help ourselves. I see

329
00:22:15,220 --> 00:22:17,520
somebody from the audience. We have a question,

330
00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:17,820
yes?

331
00:22:33,580 --> 00:22:37,100
So he meant himself like he was a tiger. Poetry.

332
00:22:37,460 --> 00:22:40,640
The new kind of poetry. The new kind of poetry.

333
00:22:40,980 --> 00:22:43,040
This is the tiger. Thank you very much. Very good.

334
00:22:43,380 --> 00:22:47,220
Yes. But again, like, I don't know how would you

335
00:22:47,220 --> 00:22:51,380
look at the word DER it's deadly terror like here

336
00:22:51,380 --> 00:22:54,500
we don't have fearful symmetry but we have deadly

337
00:22:54,500 --> 00:22:58,660
terror Deadly terror, it is, you know, it is here.

338
00:22:59,260 --> 00:23:02,560
Dur, it's deadly, you know? Here, what the hammer,

339
00:23:02,740 --> 00:23:05,280
what the chain, in what furnace was thy brain?

340
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,680
What the anvil, what the dread grasp? Dur, it's,

341
00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:12,640
now we are no longer, you know, we are no longer

342
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:17,380
given this image of the tiger, which is beautiful,

343
00:23:17,500 --> 00:23:20,580
at the same time it is terrible. It is, it is,

344
00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:23,040
it's deadly terror, you know? It can be the old

345
00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:26,500
poetry. It can be deadly terror. Yeah, but old

346
00:23:26,500 --> 00:23:29,360
poetry, how come, you know, it is the terror, you

347
00:23:29,360 --> 00:23:31,600
know? So do you want to say that this creation is

348
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:35,780
creating something old? No, he's actually

349
00:23:35,780 --> 00:23:38,360
comparing and contrasting, sort of. That's it,

350
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:41,960
yeah. Yeah, between the old kind of poetry that is

351
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:46,720
very systemized, very dreadful, very terror. But

352
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,400
again, like- And what dread had, what dread feel,

353
00:23:49,540 --> 00:23:52,980
what this creator or poet is. If you go back to

354
00:23:52,980 --> 00:23:54,980
the, I mean, the first line of the poem here,

355
00:23:55,120 --> 00:23:58,060
tiger fire burning bright. Yes. So the word

356
00:23:58,060 --> 00:24:01,340
burning and bright, both of them. Burning here, it

357
00:24:01,340 --> 00:24:05,080
reflects the efforts. that the poet is exerting to

358
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:08,120
bring something new which comes again bright

359
00:24:08,120 --> 00:24:11,180
something new yeah it's burning it's like

360
00:24:11,180 --> 00:24:14,480
electricity it's burning burning bright but it has

361
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,240
like a lot of atrocities bring something new which

362
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,260
is bright bright for the new generation but like

363
00:24:20,260 --> 00:24:22,940
look in the forest of the night in the forest what

364
00:24:22,940 --> 00:24:25,220
is the forest of the night it is i mean the old

365
00:24:25,220 --> 00:24:28,710
asias yeah but like who are active at the forest

366
00:24:28,710 --> 00:24:31,050
of the night. Like we are talking about animals,

367
00:24:31,230 --> 00:24:34,010
wild animals, you know, like monsters, deadly

368
00:24:34,010 --> 00:24:36,310
things. You know, this is what we are talking

369
00:24:36,310 --> 00:24:38,850
about. And you know, nobody would approach a

370
00:24:38,850 --> 00:24:42,150
burning bride in the forest. It is dark. So, and

371
00:24:42,150 --> 00:24:44,250
we have the night, which is always traditionally

372
00:24:44,250 --> 00:24:47,870
associated with evil. Which is a bride in the

373
00:24:47,870 --> 00:24:51,160
darkness of the old ages. It is, like, you know,

374
00:24:51,220 --> 00:24:54,380
this applies to machinery, which, you know,

375
00:24:54,700 --> 00:24:57,860
changed the life of the countryside, but it was

376
00:24:57,860 --> 00:25:00,660
like, yes, it changed the life of the countryside,

377
00:25:00,900 --> 00:25:04,920
but how? See? So it might apply to it. So again,

378
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,020
what immortal hand or eye? This is the immortal

379
00:25:07,020 --> 00:25:09,040
hand and the eye of the poet. Of the poet. Because

380
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,400
we mentioned before so many times that poetry is

381
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:16,440
immortalizing things. Yep. Let's see, let's see

382
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,780
another voice from the audience. Yes?

383
00:25:23,270 --> 00:25:29,550
Thank you very much. And if you look like tiger,

384
00:25:29,770 --> 00:25:32,650
tiger, burning bright, it's like very systematic.

385
00:25:32,830 --> 00:25:35,970
It's like a machine which goes, and if you look

386
00:25:35,970 --> 00:25:39,070
even at the rhythm, you know, it is mechanical. It

387
00:25:39,070 --> 00:25:41,150
has to do with the sound of the machine. Tiger,

388
00:25:42,510 --> 00:25:45,530
tiger, tiger, burning bright. It is a machine

389
00:25:45,530 --> 00:25:51,370
like, yes, yes please. So yeah, you can rally

390
00:25:51,370 --> 00:25:54,630
support. Okay, yes.

391
00:25:59,390 --> 00:26:04,210
Because it's

392
00:26:04,210 --> 00:26:05,490
to do with creation.

393
00:26:09,530 --> 00:26:11,710
Yeah, we use words, we don't use hammers.

394
00:26:14,450 --> 00:26:17,090
Yeah, he could have used like, what words, what

395
00:26:17,090 --> 00:26:20,150
vocabulary you like, you know? But here, with the

396
00:26:20,150 --> 00:26:21,330
hammer, with the chain, you know?

397
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,540
about the word immortal like it's like reflecting

398
00:26:28,540 --> 00:26:32,180
God or something you said or the but maybe it was

399
00:26:32,180 --> 00:26:35,140
how like people at that time looked at industrial

400
00:26:35,140 --> 00:26:37,400
revolution and machines and their product and like

401
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,140
they considered something like supernatural so

402
00:26:40,140 --> 00:26:42,560
that they the extent that they starting to worship

403
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:46,220
it and not being attention to the countryside and

404
00:26:46,220 --> 00:26:49,040
nature so it might import immortals immortal

405
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:51,620
reflects the industrial revolution and how people

406
00:26:51,620 --> 00:26:52,240
looked at it

407
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:07,220
Go ahead. What the hammer? What the chain? In what

408
00:27:07,220 --> 00:27:10,820
furnace was thy brain? What the anvil? What red

409
00:27:10,820 --> 00:27:16,720
grass? There it's dead little grass. is about this

410
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:21,340
is you know uh you know it can be like look when

411
00:27:21,340 --> 00:27:23,880
the stars look here when the stars threw down

412
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:27,060
their spears and watered heaven like it is heaven

413
00:27:27,060 --> 00:27:31,020
it seems like the heavenly you know creatures are

414
00:27:31,020 --> 00:27:33,940
angry because of this you know it is something

415
00:27:33,940 --> 00:27:37,910
which provoked the heavenly creatures and they

416
00:27:37,910 --> 00:27:40,690
started to cry they started to feel because you

417
00:27:40,690 --> 00:27:44,090
know it abused like a human life you know it

418
00:27:44,090 --> 00:27:46,850
changed it you know innocence so it is something

419
00:27:46,850 --> 00:27:52,060
you know very monstrous It caused even heaven to

420
00:27:52,060 --> 00:27:55,280
sympathize with the human people. Well, it can be

421
00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:58,240
also referred to. Okay, yes, there, Ola. I

422
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:01,080
consider the hammer and the chain as not just for

423
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,680
the industrial revolution, but also for the

424
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,160
thoughts, like the hammer and the chain are

425
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:09,930
thoughts like parents, Yeah, he could have used

426
00:28:09,930 --> 00:28:12,450
pen and you know, he could have used them, you

427
00:28:12,450 --> 00:28:15,310
know, or he could have hinted to that.

428
00:28:15,630 --> 00:28:18,930
Metaphorical. Metaphorical. He compares his

429
00:28:18,930 --> 00:28:22,690
feelings and emotions to the others. So it's not

430
00:28:22,690 --> 00:28:26,230
just the hammers and the chairs. We are not stuck

431
00:28:26,230 --> 00:28:32,330
to the text and such. Now the text is a good

432
00:28:32,330 --> 00:28:35,250
evidence for our symbolic interpretation. Beyond

433
00:28:35,250 --> 00:28:40,390
the meaning. Yeah, it can be he's utilizing the

434
00:28:40,390 --> 00:28:44,490
vocabulary and the senses of the time and the

435
00:28:44,490 --> 00:28:49,530
previous era to attack their reason, their over...

436
00:28:50,020 --> 00:28:53,680
like over rationality and overuse of systematics.

437
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:58,500
This is very metaphoric and I think you know it is

438
00:28:58,500 --> 00:29:02,520
very metaphoric about this you know is likely to

439
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,560
apply to the poem because as you see like the word

440
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,760
frame as I said and again it is their frame

441
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:12,220
Because here, daring, you know, we are talking

442
00:29:12,220 --> 00:29:14,900
about something who is rebelling against the

443
00:29:14,900 --> 00:29:18,120
creator. Like, and who is the creature who

444
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,240
rebelled against the creator? You know, it's

445
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,860
Satan. So this is satanic. We have a creature who

446
00:29:24,860 --> 00:29:27,360
is rebelling against the creator, you know?

447
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:30,760
Because here, dare, you know, the word dare again.

448
00:29:31,340 --> 00:29:34,820
So I think this is about a monstrous, you know,

449
00:29:35,020 --> 00:29:37,580
it's about the machine. It is about the industrial

450
00:29:37,580 --> 00:29:41,720
revolution. This one I strongly believe in. I love

451
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,740
the machine. Ah, okay, thank you very much. Yes,

452
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,860
Rana? But we love poetry more. And we love poetry

453
00:29:47,860 --> 00:29:51,040
more. This poem, the shape of this poem is talking

454
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:55,060
about just like revolution against poetry. And

455
00:29:55,060 --> 00:29:57,740
William Blake... Yeah, could you tell me how? Yes,

456
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,900
I want to explain. William Blake is a romantic

457
00:30:00,900 --> 00:30:04,640
man, okay? He used the vocabulary of this...

458
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:19,320
But what is more poetic than, you know, spears?

459
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:23,140
Because it's part of the poetic diction. Yes, it's

460
00:30:23,140 --> 00:30:27,120
part of the poetic diction. And, you know, we know

461
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:31,260
that, you know, this is, I think it is, you know,

462
00:30:31,380 --> 00:30:35,580
written by using most of the, you know, poetic

463
00:30:35,580 --> 00:30:40,300
devices used by the pre-Roman, by, you know, the

464
00:30:40,300 --> 00:30:42,840
non-classicals. How about he's using both

465
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,480
dictions, he's using the aspiring, the emotional

466
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,240
words and he's also using the bad and you know

467
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:51,840
hammer and all these to draw a comparison, which

468
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:56,320
one do you prefer? Do you prefer the imagination

469
00:30:56,320 --> 00:30:59,500
and the you know the beautiful beautified?

470
00:31:04,310 --> 00:31:07,410
Plague said when the stars threw down their

471
00:31:07,410 --> 00:31:11,430
spears. I think in this stanza, he's referring to

472
00:31:11,430 --> 00:31:15,170
Milton's Paradise Lost because when Satan rebuilt

473
00:31:15,170 --> 00:31:18,090
against God, he took his angels and he were in

474
00:31:18,090 --> 00:31:21,510
battle in heaven. And then when the angels beat

475
00:31:21,510 --> 00:31:25,050
Satan and his angels, they were extended to hell

476
00:31:25,050 --> 00:31:28,550
and when and did he smile his work to see like it

477
00:31:28,550 --> 00:31:33,510
reflect when God smiles about the angels that were

478
00:31:33,510 --> 00:31:37,990
defeated when they sins against him and this also

479
00:31:37,990 --> 00:31:41,530
about men can be applied about mankind when a

480
00:31:41,530 --> 00:31:44,270
mankind like when a man is sins against God he

481
00:31:44,270 --> 00:31:48,110
will be in heaven and did I agree, I agree, but

482
00:31:48,110 --> 00:31:51,390
whoever said that Satan is necessarily the

483
00:31:51,390 --> 00:31:54,050
industrial revolution. No, it's not that. Satan

484
00:31:54,050 --> 00:31:58,250
can be the bad party. Satan can be the evil. Yeah.

485
00:31:58,410 --> 00:32:01,530
The evil and that side of industrial revolution.

486
00:32:01,590 --> 00:32:03,930
Imagination devoid. Okay, we need somebody to

487
00:32:03,930 --> 00:32:05,130
reconcile between us.

488
00:32:10,630 --> 00:32:14,490
And you said spears, like in Milton's Paradise

489
00:32:14,490 --> 00:32:19,390
Lost, angels used spears to beat other angels and

490
00:32:19,390 --> 00:32:22,070
with their tears they were crying for their

491
00:32:22,070 --> 00:32:25,430
brothers who disappointed God and were punished by

492
00:32:25,430 --> 00:32:28,580
Him to be in hell. Like it's all referring to the

493
00:32:28,580 --> 00:32:32,900
evil side of the poetic. Yeah, the evil side of

494
00:32:32,900 --> 00:32:37,680
not having imagination in your poetry, of removing

495
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,640
all kinds of imagination. And who cries, and why

496
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:44,260
spears, who smiles. Like you said, it's a

497
00:32:44,260 --> 00:32:46,360
metaphoric thing to refer to the mind. It's not

498
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:48,980
metaphysical to have a very metaphorical thing.

499
00:32:54,710 --> 00:32:57,170
Yeah, how the romantic poetry changed the life of

500
00:32:57,170 --> 00:32:59,470
him. I'll tell you, like, the entire... Now, give

501
00:32:59,470 --> 00:33:02,530
me one positive thing about how the romantic, you

502
00:33:02,530 --> 00:33:05,710
know, or how the romantic imagination changed, you

503
00:33:05,710 --> 00:33:07,590
know, the face of England. Yeah, it did. I think,

504
00:33:07,670 --> 00:33:09,970
you know, this is, you know, a fallacy because

505
00:33:09,970 --> 00:33:13,350
even the Romantic period was anti-romantic, you

506
00:33:13,350 --> 00:33:16,190
know, more abuse of children, more abuse of women.

507
00:33:16,710 --> 00:33:20,170
So, yeah, there was like imagination, like they

508
00:33:20,170 --> 00:33:23,900
talk about like man's free will, but Give me just

509
00:33:23,900 --> 00:33:26,340
one thing to indicate, you know, that the romantic

510
00:33:26,340 --> 00:33:29,760
imagination transfigured or changed the life of

511
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:31,640
the English people to the rest. Of course it

512
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:33,920
changed and it was significant. If it weren't, we

513
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,460
wouldn't be studying it right now. And we wouldn't

514
00:33:36,460 --> 00:33:38,320
have studied UClassical. And it changed the entire

515
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:40,460
era of romanticism. I think you should agree with

516
00:33:40,460 --> 00:33:44,200
us that the Romantic Age was anti-romantic. And

517
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:47,340
this like, you know, I think Ms. Ahlam wants to

518
00:33:47,340 --> 00:33:50,280
share with me that, you know, the Romantic Age was

519
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:52,000
not romantic. And this is the great paradox

520
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:54,190
itself. It was not romantic. But then they were

521
00:33:54,190 --> 00:33:57,170
speaking about it because they liked it in their

522
00:33:57,170 --> 00:33:59,670
real life. So they wanted to voice it out. Yeah,

523
00:33:59,810 --> 00:34:02,250
but like, okay, here, if we are talking about

524
00:34:02,250 --> 00:34:05,130
revolutions, like, you know, poetic revolutions,

525
00:34:05,770 --> 00:34:08,130
yes, like, it is very devastating. But it wouldn't

526
00:34:08,130 --> 00:34:10,770
be a revolution. He didn't publish his work at

527
00:34:10,770 --> 00:34:13,090
that time. If he published it, then it would be a

528
00:34:13,090 --> 00:34:15,370
revolution at the same time. But he, like...

529
00:34:15,370 --> 00:34:16,810
Because it was dangerous. Tell me a poet who

530
00:34:16,810 --> 00:34:19,590
published his work while he was... Exactly. Yeah,

531
00:34:19,610 --> 00:34:23,710
most of the poets, like, privileged poets. Okay,

532
00:34:24,590 --> 00:34:27,470
it seems like we have one question. They don't

533
00:34:27,470 --> 00:34:29,950
know that those who raise questions, they gain

534
00:34:29,950 --> 00:34:34,350
marks. You see, if you, so I'm adding one mark to

535
00:34:34,350 --> 00:34:37,330
Rana and I'm adding one mark to who? Like, yes,

536
00:34:37,390 --> 00:34:39,970
they are gaining two marks. So you don't know. I,

537
00:34:40,130 --> 00:34:44,530
I was, okay. You support or you support either

538
00:34:44,530 --> 00:34:48,510
team. You are gaining more credit. Yes. Still,

539
00:34:48,830 --> 00:34:52,430
like the auction is available. The auction is

540
00:34:52,430 --> 00:34:57,190
available. Yes. Who? Now she's done guess, she's

541
00:34:57,190 --> 00:34:59,470
taking the course. It might be from the other

542
00:34:59,470 --> 00:35:05,510
class. Maybe he hit two birds with one stone.

543
00:35:06,010 --> 00:35:10,090
Maybe he meant by tiger as that of the previous

544
00:35:10,090 --> 00:35:17,070
nation's era of poets. Or maybe he is talking

545
00:35:17,070 --> 00:35:20,350
about the industrial revolution. According to

546
00:35:20,350 --> 00:35:25,530
these words, it's really... Yeah, but you have

547
00:35:25,530 --> 00:35:27,790
like, when you are answering in the exam, you have

548
00:35:27,790 --> 00:35:33,990
to commit yourself to one. Okay. Yes? I think he

549
00:35:33,990 --> 00:35:36,150
talks about the industrial revolution. The first

550
00:35:36,150 --> 00:35:40,860
standard of the last standard, I want to explain

551
00:35:40,860 --> 00:35:44,140
this class itself. Perlin tried to set about a

552
00:35:44,140 --> 00:35:47,300
machinery that burns coal to make new products,

553
00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:51,140
which saves time and effort. The force of these

554
00:35:51,140 --> 00:35:56,280
machines worked all day without stopping. And what

555
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,180
immortal Hector and I refer to the inventors,

556
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:02,980
their names are still mentioned until today. So

557
00:36:02,980 --> 00:36:06,020
their names are immortal. Their frame is a triple

558
00:36:06,020 --> 00:36:10,530
symmetry. This side of industrial revolution have

559
00:36:10,530 --> 00:36:13,050
a good side and bad side. The good side with the

560
00:36:13,050 --> 00:36:17,370
new products, saving efforts, money, time. And the

561
00:36:17,370 --> 00:36:23,020
dark side with the corruption Thank you, thank you

562
00:36:23,020 --> 00:36:25,940
for supporting. Anybody wants to support the other

563
00:36:25,940 --> 00:36:29,460
team? Like I think Ola is supporting them. Yeah, I

564
00:36:29,460 --> 00:36:32,900
just want to say that Instagram just initiated the

565
00:36:32,900 --> 00:36:35,300
reconciliation from the bargaining team when she

566
00:36:35,300 --> 00:36:38,640
said that this forum is about revolution, whatever

567
00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:43,200
that revolution is against the industrial

568
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:48,790
revolution or against the Yeah, but here we are

569
00:36:48,790 --> 00:36:51,490
debating, you know, we are debating. We don't want

570
00:36:51,490 --> 00:36:54,670
to reconcile. I think, you know, she's giving us

571
00:36:54,670 --> 00:36:57,670
credit when she reconciled, you know, because she

572
00:36:57,670 --> 00:37:00,090
is giving us credit. And, you know, I was very

573
00:37:00,090 --> 00:37:01,650
happy when she started doing that, you know,

574
00:37:01,690 --> 00:37:04,190
because she was giving us credit right from the

575
00:37:04,190 --> 00:37:08,420
very beginning. Okay, I know. Thank you very much.

576
00:37:08,820 --> 00:37:12,960
It's been a very interesting debate. Yes, you can

577
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:17,700
add something. I want to say that William Blake

578
00:37:17,700 --> 00:37:21,220
was known for being so influenced by a traditional

579
00:37:21,220 --> 00:37:24,820
theme, which is Greek gods. And we can see that

580
00:37:24,820 --> 00:37:27,820
in, for example, the hammer and the chain.

581
00:37:28,060 --> 00:37:30,120
Actually, it kind of refers to a Greek god. It's

582
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:33,940
called Hippothos, I think. It was a blacksmith god

583
00:37:33,940 --> 00:37:39,020
who was making weapons for other gods. And they

584
00:37:39,020 --> 00:37:41,640
were disdaining him for his ugliness. And then,

585
00:37:41,900 --> 00:37:44,700
also, who sees fire. It can also refer to

586
00:37:44,700 --> 00:37:48,190
Prometheus' pound. when he sees fire to mankind

587
00:37:48,190 --> 00:37:51,870
again is the will of Zeus. Also with the wings, it

588
00:37:51,870 --> 00:37:54,850
can be refers to, I think, Achilles or something.

589
00:37:55,270 --> 00:37:56,570
Well, this can actually be used against you

590
00:37:56,570 --> 00:38:00,910
because it's classical time. That's all they

591
00:38:00,910 --> 00:38:04,290
focused about. Maybe he's trying to use this to

592
00:38:04,290 --> 00:38:06,990
actually attack them because most of their poetry

593
00:38:06,990 --> 00:38:12,230
use a lot of these. No, but he's sticking to a

594
00:38:12,230 --> 00:38:15,490
very traditional theme. Use the Greek mythology.

595
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,400
I'm logging a dead horse, in fact, you know? Okay,

596
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:24,720
guys, I want to finish this wonderful debate, but

597
00:38:24,720 --> 00:38:27,100
again, thank you very much for listening, and I

598
00:38:27,100 --> 00:38:33,200
want to tell you, me and Ahlam embrace the notion

599
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:37,720
that this is about poetic imagination. Okay, and

600
00:38:37,720 --> 00:38:42,000
as I told you, you know, I am the one, but I don't

601
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:46,160
mind if you want like to take that, you know, to

602
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:49,480
that extreme because it might be about, but like,

603
00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:52,860
yes, me and Ms. Ahlam and we play this track, you

604
00:38:52,860 --> 00:38:56,360
know, we think, but some other people, strongly

605
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,760
think it is about industrial revolution, and we

606
00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:04,000
don't mind, just like giving us the evidence. He

607
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:08,220
means industrial revolution in a direct way, but

608
00:39:08,220 --> 00:39:11,830
about Gothic imagination in a direct way. Okay,

609
00:39:12,330 --> 00:39:16,450
yeah, so it is figurative and literal, but again,

610
00:39:16,730 --> 00:39:20,790
I think the BBC interpretation, like a couple of

611
00:39:20,790 --> 00:39:23,170
years ago, I brought this, BBC, do you remember

612
00:39:23,170 --> 00:39:27,030
when I brought the BBC interpretation? And most of

613
00:39:27,030 --> 00:39:30,310
the critics asserted that it was about industrial

614
00:39:30,310 --> 00:39:34,330
revolution, which I didn't like, and I tried to

615
00:39:34,330 --> 00:39:36,750
bring interpretation which was quite different.

616
00:39:37,450 --> 00:39:40,530
Yes, the last? As a student in the exam, can we

617
00:39:40,530 --> 00:39:46,350
depend Yeah, of course you can choose either of

618
00:39:46,350 --> 00:39:50,290
them, but like again, you have to go and to bring

619
00:39:50,290 --> 00:39:53,310
evidence to substantiate whatever you want to say.

620
00:39:53,650 --> 00:39:56,330
Thank you very much for listening. Thank you. And

621
00:39:56,330 --> 00:39:59,590
clap for this team. And clap for the other team.

622
00:39:59,930 --> 00:40:01,070
Thank you very much. Bye bye.