strained relationships with our mother growing up especially women uh at one point all daughters and mothers have a very toxic relationship and I had that for a few years with my mom um before I moved to Delhi and I think after that things became clear because I think there's a lot of forgiveness that comes in you grow you become wiser and you understand they're bringing their conditioning and where they were coming from I mean my mother was 16 17 when she had me what can I expect she was a child when she was Raising me um so I think yeah a lot of whatever was you know I was doing even though there was a whole thing of it being funny and comedic at the end of it there was a lot of also I wanted to talk about a lot of things that women go through um I mean I've done characters like guddi Bhabhi and zenath also later on which um of course on the face of it are funny and you know they make you laugh but if you really


you know they make you laugh but if you really think about their life stories you realize they're not like they're not the best they're not having the best time yeah that's true in many ways I think like for example what you're talking about your mother being 16 17 she there was nobody to guide right so how to be a mom how to be a wife is something that she picked up from her mom yeah and subsequently you know that and other people other people exactly you do this so many times of course there was no Google yeah like today's parents yeah exactly now the YouTube videos will explain everything to you why is the child burping why is it not burping everything is there right yeah but not your mom and not me probably where you know yeah all those things it's hard in fact um you know like uh when we're talking small town I had uh here this person called MBA chaiwala he's he's I know you know him right yes so he's also from a small town and he was


so he's also from a small town and he was mentioning how um he went for English speaking classes right and TK English you're learning how English is spoken because you know you want to do your MBA you want to get to that that strata of society and unless you learn utna betna speaking in a particular way you're not going to get accepted and getting accepted is important very important so he said I would spend extra time to understand how to do that you know like how to order tea coffee in a restaurant it is such a big deal is I mean I have personally also sat with my dictionary all the time just learning new words as a kid I was also very enamored um as a kid I was also very ashamed of where I came from so there was this constant thing in my head that I have to get out of this I have to One Day become rich One Day become this like English-speaking woman who's independent which I am right now and I'm very happy about that but


am right now and I'm very happy about that but I also realized I was coming from a bad place now of course I'm so much more um you know grateful for for where I come from and I know my roots and I and I appreciate that I I don't want to run away from it I want to accept it and take it with me and move on from that but a lot of my English communication skills because a lot of times young girls and people from small town message me about this how is English so good you know and now that it's great but I can understand that because the schools and colleges that are not perfect they're not at the level that Delhi schools would be so I did study in an English medium which I'm very grateful for my parents because I was the first girl to study in an English medium School in my family um but I had to make that extra effort as well to kind of to you know watch English movies or shows and really get the hang of it


movies or shows and really get the hang of it because somewhere my aspiration was to be this person to be able to speak in English all the time you know now of course I value Hindi more somehow because I guess English in my is our second language we have to stop making it such a big deal even right now I'm speaking in English but I've realized that there's no point judging each other you know how we used to judge each other like English accent uh Dolly like you know when I got into uh doing voicing and news and all we had to be trained to speak in a particular manner I can totally imagine I think totally we couldn't talk English just normally like suppose suppose I was to uh you know just say let me pull out something okay um you have to talk like this okay me uh just so that I can mimic it to you it's so funny because my English teacher used to say this if you don't have an accent what's the point so you


don't have an accent what's the point so you could see the school of thought this is the English accent exactly why would it come okay also Hindi huh because Hindi is not my first language okay but I would also speak Hindi just say you say you know one of your characters that's fine because it's not your first language so I'll give it to you it's it's funny when people when people whose first language it is talk like that like they don't know or they don't want to know is a retired army General who served as the 27 chief of Army staff as well as temporary chairman of the chief of staff of committee from 15th this is how I would read normally yeah right so how have we trained it was General Manoj mukundarvani born 22nd April 1960 is a retired army General who served as the 20. and speak in that accent you know it's yeah oh my God I am imagining all this so as a kid my father always I'm talking about 80s


a kid my father always I'm talking about 80s late 80s early 1990s yeah because I remember my father used to tell me watch English news watch English news and sometimes and then I would I would switch on the TV and sometimes just watch that news and I would not understand a single word because of this accent I would just understand how beautiful it sounded though I have to give it to that because they were so poised and nice and calm exactly and I would just nod my head yeah one day one day I will get it even the ads I did advertising uh I studied voiceover right and I used to I used to argue with the professor like who's why do you need that oceans of Lada to caress no complexion Lux Supreme this is so funny come by locks why not Lux you know yeah that changed slowly it was washing powder nirma yeah and then surfali Auntie came yeah and that surf Valley Auntie was popular why I think it was after the liberalization and


why I think it was after the liberalization and all of that happened in the 90s now it became Thora I think the Indian tadaka came back huh you know make it like more Indian bring it back aunties your mom my mom exactly who will say she's not washing clothes yeah her hands are not soft no they're not just manicured hands yeah she sits on the floor and beats the out of the screen she's asking us why yeah hola moms did that right yeah like so I'm sure you related to relate to all this exactly like I would relate that cause yeah these things were aspirational as you said South Delhi aunties are an aspirational thing now that you've reached that South Delhi Auntie stage where you are are professional you know what I mean to say is yeah you're economically independent you've bought a house for your parents which is a big deal before you've become 30 you've reached a knocking word you've you've become you know you


knocking word you've you've become you know you become independent in many ways which is such a huge thing for a girl in our uh you know in our country yeah so you've come to that stage how do you guard that you shouldn't become a South Delhi Auntie no because like I said I think as I'm growing up there's a lot of you know things I realize literally almost every day you know I question myself I question a lot of my past Behavior where I was coming from what kind of thought process did I have and I think a lot of my realization has to do with you know where I come from and what kind of values I hold and how much I want to safeguard those at this level because I know that you know like you said when you become independent it's very also easy to lose yourself in that process and and just keep going with the flow and make that money and become that person sin who you see every day like in my profession I see very


see every day like in my profession I see very a variety of people and uh and I sometimes feel like maybe I will become you know I find myself becoming like them and then I'll have to hold myself back oh no no no no uh you are a different person this is not you this is not what you'd ask for this is not what you'd say in this situation so um it's constant reminders to my own self uh but I think there has been a lot of just um I I just like where I come from I think I'm just more confident in life I'm much more grateful to my parents I know I can totally imagine what their struggles would have been um and I'm very happy I think a lot of it has to be given to that I'm very content with what I'm doing and uh and I feel like I want to take everybody along with me rather than jump around and become this unapproachable person um uh yeah so I think it's just constant telling yourself


yeah so I think it's just constant telling yourself this is who you are you're writing your own lines yeah you're enacting it too so you know um you take on many roles yeah at times it must be hard to say okay so what am I I'm doing this I'm doing this I'm doing this I'm jumping from One content to the next content and then and then also the reactions I'm sure there must be good ones and I mean like I'm a fan girl I love what you do but there must be people who must be saying nasty things too so of course yeah how does that how do you take both um I think it's um it's not easy at least in the beginning when the trolls started happening or in kind of hate comments um it did get to me I mean it still does but not as often thankfully um and I would I'm very competitive in life like extremely competitive sometimes like I've had therapy about that like I don't want to be this competitive I want to


I don't want to be this competitive I want to be a little more chill in life but it doesn't come naturally to me I'm trying to work for that and uh because of that fact when you get a hate comment or something like that it used to irk me a little more you know like why am I not able to please this person why is this person not happy with it so used to see the comment section of course yeah and I feel like a lot of content because you know when you're a celebrity when you're an actor you can detach from this whole social media thing you can post and leave and you don't have to engage but as a content creator as an influencer you have to engage because that's what your whole livelihood depends on okay right you have to engage with these people you have to you know take their feedback work on it all of these things because if you don't have that following how will you make that money yeah so it's a give and take and I appreciate


so it's a give and take and I appreciate there's so many people who've been following me for yours so I really really appreciate them but there will obviously be trolls like you said and it does get to you um and like you said you know I do so many characters but I you how do you maintain who you are um coping mechanism it's very difficult because uh you know during the pandemic before the pandemic there was a time where I was meeting a lot of people this was the time when we were you know our popular uh popularity was increasing and I would you know randomly bump into a lot of people or meet some people at parties and um I could see a sense of disappointment even whether in their eyes or sometimes they would say things like are you upset are you okay um and it was all coming I'm not saying that I don't blame them but it was coming from a place that you know they see me doing so much comedy on screen that


they see me doing so much comedy on screen that they were expecting the same off of me in real life and I'm not that person I'm a big introvert in real life I'm also very um like my sense of humor is not like you know how a lot of people have such amazing sense of humor that make you laugh every second and I love those people but I'm not that person my comedy actually comes a lot from my writing a lot from my observation a lot of when I'm in front of the camera camera but when I'm out of the camera when I'm away from it I am not that person exactly I will be funny here and there but I'm I'm I can't make you laugh every second it's just not me it's a character I'm playing um so a lot of times people forget that and they expect you to be this you know over the top character all the time when you're not they are like oh my God like is she okay uh not realizing that maybe this


like is she okay uh not realizing that maybe this is who I am so so that expectation yeah I did get to me I actually came to a point where I didn't want to meet anyone I was quite depressed I I think I started getting anxious about meeting people because I was like I don't want to disappoint anyone anymore and I don't want to see that look in their eyes when they meet me and they're like okay you know this is it um so I I did start therapy because of that essentially and um you know kind of talked about that at length with my therapist and now I think I'm in a better place um I've also now obviously tried to tell my audience as well that this I try to share a lot more about my personal life as in like this is who I am in reality my characters is not it so I do try to make it a little more clearer this time but I'm definitely at a place where I don't get I don't freak


a place where I don't get I don't freak out if someone gets disappointed meeting me because I'm like yeah this is who I am take it or leave it actors don't have to put so much of themselves out there exactly which is also why people can uh you know separate them that this is yeah who this is the character they acted like but this is him in real life right but with influencers or content creators the lines are very blurry and I won't blame the audience also thinking that way because you do portray so many characters and especially if you're doing comedy you do come across as a very funny person and if you're not that in real life I probably even I might think like that what were the other girls with you did they also feel that same kind of uh um disconnect at times I won't say so I so Kusha and I have had like a long journey of you know done we've done so many things together I've traveled together yeah we've traveled


together I've traveled together yeah we've traveled together because southerly girls became such a hit so we have done a lot of things together um and I think um so Kusha has a very nice extroverted personality she is actually the way she's on screen is how she's how she is okay so I think a lot of times people's confusion also came from that yeah you know so they wouldn't get they would get confused um but yeah I don't think I don't think Kusha has had that problem thankfully I wouldn't want her to um but yeah I personally face problem yeah exactly I think with komal people have had that um you know a bunch of times that uh oh she's like this in person she's a little reserved and you know this and that but our personalities are like that but it's also hard right every time you step out you expect it to look a particular Manner and yeah but those who what will you look like will you look like rajuki mummy will


look like will you look like rajuki mummy will you look like yeah thankfully I can deal with anything yeah and you've done so many like a joke about it yeah yeah I've had I've met people in pajamas buying groceries and whatnot and then it becomes like a joke it's fine yeah I got a place to meet at no how did just do that again I just love that who says that totally I don't know but I I've heard people okay I've heard people you know initially I used to find sometimes what we used to do you know uh like question Santa would give feedback like see this or say that and let's add this and add that to the video I would think like oh my God this is a little too much I don't think anybody says that but then I would suddenly meet someone who says exactly that and then I was oh my God maybe it's not as exaggerated as I thought it would be I don't know maybe they do I maybe not as not as


know maybe they do I maybe not as not as annoyingly huh also because it's the way they actually speak so it doesn't come out as annoying you you go to Bombay so often yeah but if I'm sure you also say bhaiya out there and they look at you because nobody says but you're there yeah I've started saying Dada now how do you switch you go to Bombay so often you were telling me once a week or twice a week yeah more than that sometimes because a lot of our shoots happen there most of the big shoots happen there so except for whatever I'm shooting at home uh most shoots happen in Bombay so I have to keep going to Bombay and learn the ways of Bombay because it's so different from Delhi so yeah the dada and all of that I think when you call them bhaiya they might get offended yeah so yeah you have to you have to remember everything you know I mean even Bhai sub is not there yeah it's not even


Bhai sub is not there yeah it's not even yeah and it sounds a little rude for delhiites were used to a different style of Hindi it sounds a little uh it too uh I won't say crude but it's a different way of uh speaking Yeah but there is that snobbery in Bombay too the South South Bombay South Bombay Sobo which is what is the difference between the snobbery of South Bombay and South Delhi I think it's pretty much the same except for the Bombay folks I think they they are proud of the fact that they they're not such big show-offs so for them if you were I live in and then you go and meet a South Bombay girl you think she will she she will but I'm saying that they're not as loud when it comes to their dress personalities right they are more and they're they're rich but they're the understated rich like we don't need to show it off we we will wear all the designer stuff but it won't be very loud


the designer stuff but it won't be very loud in terms of you know the logos and The Branding and all of that you will see it like if you know if you know luxury you'll know that I'm wearing luxury right um and they're a little more chill I see I feel because Bombay in itself like Mumbai people in itself they're just chill in life uh so that but yeah I mean a lot there's a lot of similarities between Sobo and South Africa village the the snobbery in the airport I won't know because I am always so covered in like blankets because I feel so cold in the AC that I'm originally tall girl where do you feel cold yeah you just asked me before I came in but yeah I've always had a very sad relationship with gold in life so I do not enjoy it in fact when I say people I tell people that I like Summers they're like they literally want to slap me because summers in Delhi are a nightmare so I'm


summers in Delhi are a nightmare so I'm going to send a camera team just to see what you wear when you go to the airport and I have this neck pillow which which also has a hoodie like a bear neck pillow now see okay we've done Shahrukh Khan we've done Amitabh Bachchan now you're in Amir Khan who takes uh who takes a pillow to the airport I am comfort for me is the most is the biggest priority so yeah so uh you are comfortable in Bombay and you're comfortable in Delhi yes but you live in gurgaon gurgaon so please tell me about the the snobbery of good guy because I'm not trying to look down upon any place yeah but every city has has that thing yeah you know which is like you go to shadi's and all that and when they say and then you turn around and like every place you know like you go to Bombay it's like we were talking about that if you were to say that I live in


that if you were to say that I live in you know clean they're not going to pay attention if you say if you're in Delhi and you say pitampura they're not paying attention you uh in uh you go to um Chennai you have to be dressed in that proper manner when you go for weddings and you have to wear the sarees you have to have a nose pin six diamonds seven dimensions I remember how these aunties would say where in Calcutta you know like it's that eyebrow where to live even in uh luck now even of course every every city has I mean when we did Saudi Ariels we used to get so many comments from Pakistan as well that you know even in Lahore and Karachi we have similar crowds here and similar South South I think the southern regions in every city or every place where yeah all over the globe are the rich right they reside there their behavior patterns are the same the snobbishness of Lahore aunties is at a different level


of Lahore aunties is at a different level only like and Karachi is a little bit like Bombay yeah you know yeah the Delhi Bombay of Pakistan yeah so Lahore is like yeah you have to have you know your bharize outfits and Lawn kidney you know and then it's like Seasons you know so the Islamabad and the Lahore aunties will judge you or whether you're wearing last season's uh Lawn Lawn is their cotton it's that very it's your Good Earth you know then yeah Good Earth and a raw mango softly energy you know when you get yeah where is your sari from how would you reply Dolly raw mag if it was Fab India how would you reply any conversation with anyone from those places because even in gurgaon I'm living in the most um what do you say the middle class regions I'm not living in an apartment so you have no Livery debater coming with the train not at all not at all not at all okay but now that's your aspiration


not at all okay but now that's your aspiration yeah but gurgaon uh snobbery as you call it is also is the same people who were in Delhi they have either their young children have moved after you know getting married or something have bought the new flats and apartments in the Magnolias and the what was the other ones yeah exactly so all these Rich Deli families Heritage yes exactly exactly so the security at these apartments that gated community I think you have to tell them five times Who You Are yeah you know even that like in many of these places uh it's there in white tiger also when you hear yeah it's you know this they think that people like your drivers and the maids and the guards and all they don't understand you you're seeing now this even Noida keju you know the the fights which are happening with the guards where some of these owners think that they are some kind of a low life they don't they don't understand you they don't they're not


they don't understand you they don't they're not worthy of a of respect as another human yeah it's it's that level of but I think I I feel like of course there's a lot of rich people who do that because somewhere I feel like money hinders their view but uh I have to say that in our country it doesn't always depend on how rich or poor you are it's there's so many divides so um you know when it comes to looking at another person as if there are some roaches uh or just not um a full person right you don't give them the respect that happens with I think everyone um and um I feel like at some level you also have to unlearn a lot of things like I I come from family where you know our uh you know the class divide or the class divide is so um you know we come from up so it's very out there it's very like this person belongs to this cast or which cast do you belong to and this and that or which class


you belong to and this and that or which class and all of these things so you're always me so aware of these things that you're growing up growing up that now you have to unlearn these things that you know you're you're you're you can't stereotype people like that or you can't judge people like that or do you find yourself you know like correcting yourself when you can because a lot of times I've collect anyone is I think while growing up also I used to have fights with my mother all the time and I I mean now I can see where she was coming from she also has to unlearn all these things now we are doing that together um but yeah a lot of times you know suddenly I'll be like okay why did I say that why did I say it like that hmm you know um I can be nicer than that uh it's my internal you know it's an internalized thing that you feel like oh you're at this level and this person is at that level so


this level and this person is at that level so you can be like this to them not saying that I've been like but that's what you have to do right you have to unlearn you have to correct yourself each time you do something like that uh of course the people that we're talking about do not realize any of this yeah uh they keep going on they don't care uh but I think uh because it's such a you grow as a human you grow as a human and I think that it's I mean I've seen a lot of rich people who are also extremely nice extremely sweet they understand their privilege um they probably are also trying to help out so it's not like it's a big stereotype that all the rich are like this but yeah of course stereotypes also exist for a reason right um so it is a pattern for sure but I think all of us collectively whether you come from money or not we all have our judgments we all have our you know boxes that we put people in


have our you know boxes that we put people in like we are talking about rich people and we think like there are a certain way but not always so when you put it across in a comedic manner yeah it makes many people rethink yeah of course that's what I'm saying stereotypes come from somewhere so if you're telling me they're just laughing at them it's making us rethink yes oh my God am I like this too yes and when you re if you're a sensitive person you'll realize oh my God I make this mistake too yeah and and then you know what happens uh dollies many times that you people rise from that level of not being able to say pizza properly yeah and then you come to the level of pizza you're able to say pizza you're able to say hors d'oeuvres yeah you're able to say noodles instead of noodle and after that you come to that level and then you start looking down on people exactly yeah that's what I'm saying yeah


people exactly yeah that's what I'm saying yeah you know exactly so uh to guard yourself that you shouldn't become that snob that you used to look at yeah that you used to hate yeah yeah that that comes with a lot of learning and being sensitive for sure you have to be very self-aware otherwise you will like I said Lose Yourself you will become that person you always dislike yeah you know who look down at you and now you're doing the same thing to another person right from small town to Delhi to Bombay and now you're in gurgaon and you're like hopping cities making content yeah how do you remain sensitive to these things I mean at the end of it I feel like it's just about trying to be a good person and that's Universal so whether you are in Mumbai or Delhi or gurgaon or America or wherever you are I think at the end of the bottom line is are you a good person are you treating people with kindness and are you being nice to


people with kindness and are you being nice to them I think it all comes down to that and if you are whether language is a barrier or something I think your emotions whose language uh not always I don't think so I mean I do feel like my English is not that great still I feel like uh my vocabulary is really small but um like I said like I don't hold myself back or I don't let that thing about me hold me back in any way um and I'm trying to obviously learn in the process but yeah I I don't think it was at any point a barrier big enough that could like stop me you know you're brave enough to say that uh the toxic comments um hurt you and you search therapy you know I've had several people coming on this podcast who very successful people in their own respective field and I asked them the same question that you know the toxicity many of us are told that be strong right ignore ignore why do you look at the comments


right ignore ignore why do you look at the comments why do you bother just do your work you are giving them attention you're giving them attention ignore but it's not possible right it's not easy I mean I try to I of course I try to ignore of course I try to drive out my attention to all the love that I'm getting which is amazing uh but you know human being it will get to you you have a you know tiny heart and a brain that functions in a way and you have those nerves and anxiety and all of that so it can happen it's bound to happen so there's I mean it's very easy to say that just ignore I just let it be let it go it's fine you have how you have bigger things plus I have bigger things of course I'm enjoying the love that I'm getting but that doesn't mean that this little comment can't hurt me or I have a shield across me right now some can sometimes it can but of course I've been working on


sometimes it can but of course I've been working on it nicely and I think I'm at that place right now especially that I could not care less of all the trolls because I think thanks to therapy thanks to obviously talking so many of my friends are in content creation so we have a very closed group of just you know support group you can say where we talk about things it's very important to have that in any profession that you're in I think it's very important to have friends from that profession so you understand each other's pain points necessarily women women you can have men women anybody yes and I I my partner is from a different background altogether right so he also brings in that perspective of what it is like to not be in this position right sometimes I would be so worried about something like oh my God this comment came or this feedback came and I'm so worried about it didn't work and suddenly he'll see some think so rational how does it matter your last video worked this much like


does it matter your last video worked this much like something so simple he'll say and then you'll be like oh yeah I didn't I didn't think about this he's not scared I know I mean I may mimic him in private it's only a person does he think that you're going to make him one of your characters but a lot of times I mean we've talked about this a lot of times you know my comedy uh because my comedy it's very observational it's very like it comes from your life right correct so anytime we're having some fight or like there's something new that has happened in our life a version of that will show up in my one of my videos because because our content ideas come from like our life family so any conversation you've had with a person you've observed someone or anything that you have suffered or been through then you'll be like oh wait this is a good part good topic for Content everybody goes through this why don't I make some content because it's so


why don't I make some content because it's so relatable mom has come uh and your partner is their dad brother of course I I make so many skits where I have like I play my brother also and my father also and all of them from your yes yes I have no other point of reference okay a lot of it I like honestly it's so it's so funny that we talk about it as a family how uncanny sometimes it is we'll get you literally you're speaking like the father you're speaking like the brother this literally the nuances because I've observed them all my life right so it it comes naturally even when I'm trying not to be like them I am like them so you didn't get a lot of these chachis and aunties in your family coming in with what I'm doing and there's been a distance but I personally have not engaged with them um I've only engaged with the people who are enjoying my work um you know my relatives who have nice things


work um you know my relatives who have nice things to say and actually do watch my videos so they are sweet they are fun to talk to and then we talk about you know what's happening and what's not but people who are you know either bad-mouthing me or not interested or jealous in any way I really don't care yeah I have always been that person I'm very like especially in terms of relatives and family I've always safeguarded myself and I don't have useless conversations with people I think that I was that person always growing up like I told I would tell my mother that I don't want to talk to this relative out of just like just because they're my relative I have to talk to them no but it comes for a lot of women uh who are yeah I mean and a lot of family setups are like that where you have to please them where you have to talk to them where you know maybe you are you are close to them and they will say certain things my


close to them and they will say certain things my opinionated women are always that they always consists education has happened you get that I mean yeah not in a relationship when I was single and I was looking for love I would be like yeah because feminism you weren't going on dates yeah I was but I would get disappointed meeting the men and I would be like are my standards too high so how do you meet your partner but that's never a problem please don't tell me in South Delhi no no I met him on a dating app on a dating app okay how modern is that exactly yeah and have you I didn't have to sacrifice yeah I mean I did but he thankfully he did not know of me okay he came from another world altogether and that was a great thing because anybody who knew of me I would not date them so because like I said right they have this nobody knows that is so different from who I am and I would get these you know messages like if


and I would get these you know messages like if I would match with someone and they'd be like oh a big rajaki mummy fan and suddenly I'd be like oh God that's what I did right now no but like no but I'm not dating you right I'm I'm planning on dating this person and I get it they love logical way that's great but they will come with the perspective that I will be someone like Raju but you will keep making or you'll keep making them laugh like this I have to say you tell that to your boyfriend exactly right yeah role playing like you know of course that's not going to happen so I have to be a little like I wanted a fresh start like I wanted to start with someone who really gets to know me for me first and then gets to be introduced to this whole side of me right okay so when Manu also my partner did find out that you know I make videos and I do this comedy and all of that his friends told him and


and all of that his friends told him and I rationed him I I was like you know I I I'm allowing you one video a day you can't overdo this because you have to keep my personality intact in your eyes like you you have to remember this is why he must have thought are you gonna judge me like you judge all these ladies and you judge all these guys I have to get to this point that you meet so many celebrities yeah how do they react to you like do they they appreciate you in your various avatars or do they want you to do things like you know act out in a particular manner how do they react to you uh I mean I have to say they're all extremely sweet about it and um thankfully most times they know what's coming because either they have seen the videos or they have been prepped that you know this person is coming and they're going to do some kind of this video and you have to be prepared for that they've read the script


have to be prepared for that they've read the script and all of that has happened so a lot of friends it's easier it's like a soft launch but sometimes uh when either they are not on social media or they've not seen them they don't know and then suddenly you know especially when I become a rajkum yeah because when I'm explaining to them I'm talking to them I talk like this here this is the script this is what we're gonna do I'll be a little exaggerated over the top but like be okay and like don't worry and everything is a part because you're a director also attack yeah I mean yeah and I'm doing right now especially I'm doing my whole thing by myself right so I'm the one who's briefing them giving them the direction explaining what the concept is and then suddenly when the Pala goes over my head and I do the Hello friends chai pillow and suddenly they'll be like I've did a video with Ranbir Kapoor and he was so


video with Ranbir Kapoor and he was so taken aback and I'm screaming because as rajuki mummy it's part of the character that you scream and shout and and be honestly obnoxious about it and he literally really was trying to get away from me because it got that loud even if you might not have grown up with these characters but somewhere you've met them you've come across a person like that even even someone is she's so out there she's so different and she's so like she loves herself unabashedly and she's always joking about her divorce and her husband and her husbands were sick to me you know so um it's all there yeah it's so out there but I've still received so many messages saying I have this Barbie in B Block who's exactly like this I have this neighbor who's exactly like this so you know you like it though and you get that of course I love it I love it um so I think there'll be people who tell you you


so I think there'll be people who tell you you exaggerate a lot of people I think a lot of people who are like that kind of pendant get offended I know you know have you seen ayush Radha yes I love her right so she does that South Indian thing so well yeah she's like every want that I know of yeah she's exactly like that now we've all gone through that right our mom's telling us yeah one day here one day there yeah right and she always says so she tells you that you know oh Amazon right you know and and then we don't know the word for that the Oakley everybody has you know sometimes there are things in your kitchen which you don't know the name but you just know why do you know Oakley because you've learned oh say Oakley yeah right actually remember what it is Oakley but I would have learned that but I don't know the kannada word for it so she also what is that well she makes it so realistic she's so good


well she makes it so realistic she's so good but then some of my Arts don't like it she exaggerates she doesn't talk like we don't talk like that suppose because you're not observing you talk like that I talk like that even we all do that yeah it's she's got a Danish say it is another one yeah it was so good with accents and he's another person who when I tell my uncles uh this is how you talk this is exactly how this is so funny because you know I mean as friends also when you enact each other like reacting you you become a little like defensive a lot of friends of my friends would enact me and they'd make this like really nasal voice okay and I know I'm very aware that I have a nasal but then suddenly I'll be like I don't have a voice like that what do you mean you know suddenly my voice will go deeper and I'll be like you know you become a little bit don't we all do that


become a little bit don't we all do that when we're sitting with friends and suddenly somebody will turn around I know you know when we were in college and there was one friend of us who was who was living who lived in Karol bagh yeah so we used to always say yeah you know because it was but she won't know what she won't know and she used to get really mad at us exactly you know okay what the hell do you mean yeah and we were like you know sorry we didn't realize yeah and they know of course there was no you know there was no sensitive you can't call anybody's accent out because you even have noticed which is a nice thing is that when you see TV channels and you look at news people speak in their own voice yeah it doesn't matter English that is Indian yeah that you are speaking and that's how you I don't only know this English I totally know yeah and people are okay with it and I didn't you that is so difficult


it and I didn't you that is so difficult though no I don't really know yeah she will give it to you English English I said now tell me your thing where is your life leading you now you keep innovating which I love thank you so now what are you uh going on I think content for sure is uh obviously going to happen in Instagram YouTube videos all of that is going to keep happening I'm just I'm just trying my level best to obviously bring the level up uh make better content content that I'm more proud of I love writing I've realized that I've I enjoy writing a lot whether it is a small script um Hindi I think mostly I think it's in English because we talk in English yeah I think a lot of times growing up because I was so obsessed with English I used to think like oh I think in English how teachers ask you what are you thinking huh what's your what's the language that you're thinking I used to think that I think in English but


I used to think that I think in English but I've realized that Hindi is where my comfort lies okay so um and I think English mostly I write in English because that's what we talk in and we you know so you're writing so a lot I'm trying to yeah um this is your blog and your uh yeah so for my yeah for my Instagram YouTube and maybe for some bigger projects if I want to do like a longer script maybe like a short film or something some planning I'm trying to kind of get into endorsements that's not coming here well who knows who knows exactly I mean I never thought I'd do Colgate I mean given the kind of teeth I have okay but it happened so you know never say no never scenario so you you think big products will come your way because you know these big guys realize that you can't you can't possibly sell everything with Sachin Tendulkar or with uh you know of course yeah I think influences as a as an industry um


I think influences as a as an industry um we've grown so much in the past two years everybody has realized importance we we are having events which are only influenced for influencers so you can imagine the number like I was literally noticing the other day that I've been to at least two to three Creator events this year which is only full of creators there's no other guests so only young creators old creators just creators and these are like places full of people so imagine the number of creators we have right now that's the speed that this industry is growing at and I think everybody whether it is brands or people in the Bollywood industry everybody realizes the importance and the value that influences hold right now and it's totally um it's not organized like the Bombay film industry it's not like Noida I mean news channels here yeah we did have the ASCII guidelines in the middle we have those to follow so these guidelines are about how how um how transparent you have to


are about how how um how transparent you have to be when you do any kind of paid promotion whether you're misleading people or not what kind of procedures you might have to follow you know how you see those paid partnership tags or hashtag ad or basically to make it very clear to your audience that this is a paid promotion and you're getting money to see this so that they don't take it 100 like to the they don't believe you 100 and they know there's a certain level of advertising you know right um so all of that so definitely I feel like the industry uh is being acknowledged a lot more and we are being taken more seriously which is which feels great okay uh but obviously it's still very unorganized and we work at home you know so what are the products that you would say is I don't I don't want you to take names obviously because they were sick but just say uh I would like hesitate to uh have on my show for example somebody who's doing


have on my show for example somebody who's doing quackery like you know I would say quackery but that yeah exactly anything that I'm not um either not going to ever use or just don't know the science behind it any kind of when it comes to products or if it's about like a lot of times I don't do you know those rummy and all kind of things the games the poker games and those uh apps um again whitening fairness um anything related to that mental health if you're selling um you know um even women's day in fact I remember last year on women's day I didn't do a single campaign because I really want to see the brand do better it should not be like the women's day again we have woken up let's do something for women please make video let us pay you and then bye bye we don't care about women anymore right so um I realized you know whatever campaigns were coming for women's day were all brands who had not personally seen them do anything for


brands who had not personally seen them do anything for women exactly and then they would pitch it as also CSR activity it's a CSR activity so uh please do it for free hi hi or please do it for less money it comes to you now a lot keep free content especially when it's CSR building but you are you are a multi-million dollar company yeah so if you are doing this good work why should I not get the money I am still poor so give me you know that's what I'm saying so if it was an actual NGO trying to reach out and trying to get help that's a different thing but if you're a company who's a global company making millions of dollars every year every month why shouldn't you pay yeah so that that's where I call them out then I don't do such things I'm like your CSR activities to you do it good for you looks good on your profile not for me because I know you have money to pay me but you're not gonna because you're going you're


but you're not gonna because you're going you're using my platform you're using my followers but we are not getting anything out of this which actor would you really want to act with a woman man anybody do you really have to take one name yeah I would love to work with that at a party recently and she knew of me and I was so like yeah I mean there's so many more names I can take but if I really have to choose one and just choose from my heart I think and who are the people who you've worked with in the Bombay film industry who you were really surprised that you know you didn't think of them to be something but they turned out to be something else completely oh I mean I've done videos with a lot of them and I think what happens is on I've done videos with them and they're doing promotions which are already so hectic uh but I've seen some of the actors do so much hard work to promote their films and it really shows how much


to promote their films and it really shows how much they care uh one of them has to be Wiki kaushal he's so driven and he's so he's really into his craft like I remember doing a rajuki mummy video with him which was a one take Wonder uh our chemistry was on fire and it was literally I think three four five seven minutes of just one video going on and on and our banter and we were very happy with it like our team was very happy with it we were very happy with it and that's how much how much he wanted it to be better and how much he wanted himself to be better and that I think shows a lot uh similarly I think uh you know meeting nawazuddin sir or pankaj to party sir was amazing they are also such great actors yeah um you know even Karthik Aryan is so driven Priyanka Chopra she has this personality energy that is a global icon let's be honest right so when she does she comes into a room


right so when she does she comes into a room she owns it there is nobody else in the room okay right it's just her everybody's looking at her everybody's just in awe of her whether you love her do not like her whatever you just cannot ignore her right it's that thing so I think I'm a Delhi person yeah so when I would go to Bombay to interview some people um like you know you grow up thinking ah this actor you know you have a crush on that person you're growing up and then when you actually meet them sit down to work with them whatever I mean mine would be interview I'd be so disappointing and I would say yeah I should never meet your crush in real life what they are on screen and what in real life are different Jesse camera the magic comes on that person transforms yeah and then you realize why they are the way they are exactly exactly but for me it's it's actually I've seen that a lot uh you know where they're professional they have


a lot uh you know where they're professional they have their boundaries they're not like extremely friendly or anything and initially I think probably I would have thought that oh my God that other actor was so friendly and nice why is she not friendly and nice or why is he not friendly but then as you grow and because I'm just as much a part of the industry now I'm trying to enter that industry I'm also I also have a little Fame of my own which is different right uh it's Fame and like I said right I used to think that people are disappointed yeah you know meeting me so I realized that it was also my own hypocrisy of thinking that that other actor was so nice and sweet it's probably her firewalls exactly they are trying to safeguard themselves they don't have to be best friends with me yeah it's not their job yeah they're here to act they're here to do their job which they are doing perfectly fine um so if they have a wall around them if they're trying


if they have a wall around them if they're trying to safeguard their interests that's completely okay yeah so I think I've I thank you have not met a person who's mean or anything especially not to me because they have to work with me I think it's a lot of I've also like talents Talent versus Talent right yeah of course they can I don't know if they're mean to other subordinates out there of their own but at least with me none of them have been anything of you know rude or anything but yes the difference of maybe their outgoing and more friendly or maybe they are just a little guarded that's it this thing about nepotism you are also somebody from small town India came to Delhi bigger city and then going to a bigger city getting into films and this whole question of nepotism which has been doing the round so you don't have a sugar daddy you don't have a you don't have a Godfather you don't have anybody in Bombay but you want to


don't have anybody in Bombay but you want to make it in there right you're ambitious yeah that's the big bad World scare you at times yes it really does uh I'm also someone who does not know anything about networking and I've realized how badly you need to network because initially I used to come from this perspective that you know my work is going to speak for itself I don't have to go around talking about it and I just can't but it's been a slow realization that you know after a point you kind of have to um and it's not good or bad it's not like unless you um you know talk to them or please them they won't give you work it's not like that I think it's a lot about just putting your face to it just meeting them so that they remember you so that they know oh you know this other girl is also interested in acting why don't we try her out so I think it's just about that um which for me is a little hard


about that um which for me is a little hard because I'm it doesn't come naturally to me so when I do step into a party I have to just like prep myself for like two hours of networking and talking to people and then we'll be fine so then do you bring outfit myself just a little more like my extroverted version a chatty a chatty version who's not like as awkward in real life but uh but yeah so that is happening for sure it does scare me a little bit because opportunities do not come as easily or or as naturally to you as they would to some someone who's already from the industry or from a family that belongs to the industry at the same time there is a different sort of you know advantage that influencers have of course because we have a following so a bunch of times you know we will get auditions who uh for characters because they think that not only will this person be able to do it because it's comedy it's similar Typecast


do it because it's comedy it's similar Typecast right yeah and and we would also get their following when the film releases or the show releases right we would we would tap into their following because they will be promoting the same thing so that also happens and it's both good and bad because you do get an advantage you do get your first chance to enter the industry at the same time you will be typecasted they might not give you a chance to do something different from what you already do because they don't really take but you seriously as an actor doll leasing would be fine no you don't want to get Typecast as sister role but that's what it is system cast as best friend and sister role who's a who's funny funny huh right so basically being typecasted as the funny girl which is fine of course like I said it's opportunities so I am not going to sit here and not realize my privilege I do uh if I'm getting these opportunities I know a


uh if I'm getting these opportunities I know a lot of actors are trying and not getting even these right so of course I understand that and I'm very grateful but at the same time now it's like I've done so many like me and Kusha we call each other like jaggered best friends you know we always play best friends best friends so at this point it's a little bit of like craving to do a lot more to do something different to do something that maybe does not require you to have comedic timing okay so one more question it just struck me is that you know you in the middle of the podcast people are talking about toxicity of relationships and yeah and I have to ask you you know that that influencers get a lot of hate uh toxic comments coming now there's this person called urfi you know who wears very bizarre clothes her fashion sense is is very shocking yeah and the idea is to shock yeah right yeah but she doesn't get the comment so much about


yeah but she doesn't get the comment so much about her outfits as that she's a Muslim who's wearing this yeah you know so she gets a lot of hate from Hindus and Muslims from traditionalists and modernists yeah and she's quite daring in that case another level yeah I love her I think um I think an independent woman really scares the society hmm anytime you see a woman being free scares you even woman it scares me a little bit oh my God like is she gonna be okay yeah is she fine like why is she doing the why should why is she trying to take so much attention why can't she just like be under the radar you know you you get you as a woman you have a fear as anxiety you become like why is she like this why is she wearing things like this oh my God she's bad she's a bad influence you know so I I think personally I mean so many men have done this for years you know getting attention or doing


done this for years you know getting attention or doing whatever they want to do it's only when a woman does something she wants to do it becomes a problem um so for sure I feel like anyone who's calling her out I mean if you don't if you really do not like it don't look at it yeah don't give it the tension the problem is you are giving it the attention and what she is doing is she's taking it that's what she loves and she's killing it right that's what she came for yeah so here you're the one losing she's winning so if you really have a problem move on move on to other things there were these films which were made about uh Bombay and how people go to uh funerals and jotha do you remember and you did a Content thing is they have a full closet you know just for this full of whites and Good Earth it has to be dressed right for them of course of course I feel like I mean I remember when I went to meet


like I mean I remember when I went to meet a friend whose grandmother had recently passed and it was my first time meeting someone you know as an adult like you feel like oh God someone has died and I have to go meet their family and all of them all your parents are doing all of this right but this was the first time I went and I wore red my friend later like it's fine and then when he was dropping me back to my cab he's like uh you know foreign but people like these are very very particular about what they want to wear the sunglasses also have to be on point you know which Prada which Burberry classes do they want to wear and then their all their whites have to be nice even in the whites it's like which designer do I want to wear today who deserves what to tell these people who sit there with their hate comments I did a podcast on Mental Health yeah the first comment uh dolly was like yes and then there'll be some people


was like yes and then there'll be some people who'll say you are encouraging women to do this mental issues I mean everything is a problem you say I love myself I have self-love makeup okay all right people who are like you know how big girls are doing like you know body positivity you know promote career fat um she's just saying that she likes her body she's happy in her body of course she'll work to uh be fit whenever she wants to and if she feels like if your body requires it but is obesity like you know people have a comments you are you are manifesting a voice to that aren't you yeah and I'm giving it a creepy uh stupid voice because that's exactly what they would sound like I imagine when they when they say to you also yeah foreign they will have all the reasons in the world I feel like no matter what you say especially right now on the internet because I feel like the the as you know how internet is both of being in a


you know how internet is both of being in a boon and all of that so pros and cons are always there so while it is you know connecting all of us and we have social media has brought us so much good but it's also bringing the bad out of people the the fact that they can anonymously say things to each other and not get anything out of it right like you I can't really find this person and do something to them all I can do to keep my own sanities to ignore them yeah um and that's honestly a little sad yeah right uh but that's what I'm saying that because of this whole thing there's been such a increase um of these kind of comments not just to me but like everybody around that I see whether it is celebrities or influencers or even random people on the internet who don't even have these professions not even calling for this attention are getting that attention we get these unsolidated unsolicited picks from men demands random creepy messages stalking you know um


men demands random creepy messages stalking you know um it's just a sad State of Affairs it does sometimes you know I I've had instances where I'm traveling and someone would take a sneaky video and post it or message it to me that I saw you I mean just say hi just come and say hi to my face don't be a little creep don't take these stockish you know these videos of me where I'm not aware that I'm being recorded yeah um yeah but internet has made that happen young girls getting into the profession would you tell them to become content creators to do videos to get into the film industry or you just say be very very strong and if you're not it's going to get tough no I'm not gonna say that I think it's very important um both the fields are amazing um and if you if you are someone who's interested in it definitely go for it there is I think there is no better time right now is a great time because we are having these


now is a great time because we are having these debates we're talking about nepotism we are challenging all of these things that have already existed for years and years and centuries right so this is actually the greatest time to be a content creator or to uh try acting or all of these things and I feel like all the girls who um have these aspirations I would definitely push them to come forward and try their hand at it uh of course uh what I would suggest is just to try to safeguard their own interest have a close group of friends or family someone you can confide in don't let social media um be the only place that you go and come back from have a life like even right now even I'm trying to have that like I realized in the last year that I was doing nothing else but social media and I was doing nothing else but make videos um there was no life I was not learning anything new I was not traveling much I didn't have much going on in my


much I didn't have much going on in my life except for this so I it also becomes and that honestly is true for every profession that sometimes treat your work is work and not let it be your whole life which is very important so what I would suggest to young girls would be just to safeguard their own interest a little bit be aware be aware of their rights be aware of what they can do what they can't do what people can do to them and can't do all of these things is very important and um yeah in the end just feel free chase your dreams don't hold yourself back no matter where you come from what kind of money you come from it's a great time even if you have a small phone and internet on it it's fine that's all you need so where does Dolly Singh want to go say two years from now five years from now uh I definitely want to act more I have a film that will hopefully release next year okay that's nice yeah yeah so um that is


year okay that's nice yeah yeah so um that is happening I'm auditioning a lot more another thing that is happening with me is I've just launched a mini collection of candles that I've made from scratch and not made myself there's a brand involved but on kivo collection you know conceptualize Kia and I did this one very weird video about like have you seen candle names these days old books you know Cafe Cappuccino so I realized that candle names these days are very funny you know they write whatever so I was like okay whatever let's let's make it fun and I did that video where I was like you know it should it should be like Wiki kosher's armpits I'd like to smell that or like golgappa you know uh or like PESA okay imagine if I have a candle I'm doing a party Dolly and I've got I've bought your candle and it's called so everybody will be craving that and not what are the other names so so now


and not what are the other names so so now I mean those are the names that I put in the video and then uh the brand reached out to me and we did a collection together which was very nice uh so now we have names like um that sounds really pathetic I know but sometimes you need that energy in your life ah yes can I buy a dozen of those please and I I also have a candle called nuzzle blocker okay because I've realized you know I I always used to be like now I am like this oh God everybody becomes like that because I feel like also after a point when you have something to lose you become more like another Yogi yeah yeah so we've kept those names and obviously the candles are great so Dolly what do you feel coming on a podcast with Smitha prakash and I want you to say that foreign um it's my Chanel shoes that I got last time from Paris and Sunita married I don't shop for myself anymore I just approve


don't shop for myself anymore I just approve oh my God you're so good you're so fabulous thank you so fabulous thank you so much Let's do let's do that how do you do that how do you do that you really sound like somebody who's saying but you do one thing I used to always find funny that you know I'm playing these southerly characters and my teeth are still like like any South Delhi person who has money will fix this first thank you thank you so much for speaking with me all the best to you and I hope you get great success thank you so much I'm so I'm so happy to be finally here and doing this with you it was such a beautiful conversation thank you thank you for watching or listening to this podcast where I spoke with Dolly Singh I hope you like And subscribe on whichever Channel you have seen this or heard this namaste thank you [Music]


what your history teacher has probably told you in school they were just teaching what was there in the syllabus but to know that a lot of that is concocted uh you know history in the 7th Century he along with several others during his time ensured that the Arabs beyond that narrow portion of Sindh never managed to get to the mainland of India the herd's wives is taken away as I mean Mohammed bin qasim forcibly marries her the other one commits uh johar when Mahmoud of ghazni comes to somnath Temple and he is quite shocked to see 50 000 common Hindus all armed in some you know manner defending their Temple 400 500 of the family who were hanged from trees on deepavali and to this day the Monday they don't celebrate that's also a living history and despite that we do perverse things like tipu jayanti and all of that every year is like one generation lost and most children then don't read history Beyond say class 10 or 12.


don't read history Beyond say class 10 or 12. a i podcast with Smitha prakash today my guest is Vikram sampath noted author and historian whose new book bravehearts of Bharat has created a few ripples Vikram seven earlier books include two volumes of Veer savarkar which also generated a lot of interest Vikram has a doctorate in history and music Dr sampa thank you for coming to our Studios most honored that you're coming here to discuss your book and much more thank you smitaji it's always a pleasure to talk to you I'll be calling you smithaji if you insist on calling me Dr sampath I think Vikram works well enough okay so during the course of this podcast it's going to be Vikram which it is offline so um so you know um in your book you say in your new book which is a bravehearts of Bharat in this you say that India doesn't tell its story and as Sanjeev sannyal said and I'm quoting from that


sannyal said and I'm quoting from that the manner in which Indian history is depicted as is a it's a long Litany of failure videos every battle we are taught about is one in which India or Indians have only lost we're made to appear as a nation of losers nation of losers before I get to your book I'm going to get to your tweets oh God yes I know see this is how I trick my guess because your your Tweet on savarkar you've written on wheat sarkar two volumes eminently readable though very voluminous I must say it took me a lot of time people you know doing the lockdown as dumbbells also for a lot so it's it's only if you have misconceptions or if you have if you're a serious reader of history that you know two volumes get consumed get absorbed quickly but anyway so your Tweet on uh on Rahul Gandhi you called him an imbecile so that made a lot of news why were you so angered I was


lot of news why were you so angered I was not anger at Smitha it was just that you know I've been telling the same thing from the last three years that's why I put out another tweet you know giving links to all the interviews all the videos uh you know talks lectures interviews with almost all the channels of all ideological tilts left right and Center where we've been talking about this uh he wrote Mercy petitions he was complicit in Gandhi's assassination he was in islamophobe he was the reason for the two Nation Theory all this has been done to death and it's just that suddenly someone just comes up with the same dead horse to flog and then you know how the media Works immediately there are Panic calls from all the guest relations saying tonight eight o'clock there's one show nine o'clock there's one show and I'm really tired saying the same thing in autopilot mode it's like a broken gramophone record that I go on so uh yeah I was more


that I go on so uh yeah I was more exasperated and I think intellectually and mentally fatigued to take on this and I think uh he was just doing it for the sake of publicity who in his life is a very revered figure and he has an ally there for whom savarkar is a very revered figure they've been asking they've distanced themselves from that comment yes I mean there was a time when balasubthakre had said that manishankaraya will never be allowed to enter Maharashtra for the comments he made on uh the ships has been one party which has been consistently asking for the Bharat ratna for him much before the BJP also entered The Fray so I'm sure his advisors know the Dynamics and the poor Mr thakre is already you know surrounded with so much problems he's hemmed in from all sides his party has split why would anyone in their right mind uh embarrass your ally at such a going to their state when they've already had


such a going to their state when they've already had a split and cause this so and his son went and joined that Bharat jodo yatra and this was just after that so I really don't know uh who the advisors particularly on historical matters are because these are such juvenile comments that was I mean uh someone signing off as your most obedient servant uh we had Mahatma Gandhi signing off like that Subhash Bose that was the that was the template of the time the colonial Masters you were always addressing and I think everybody should have gone through the rigors of cbsc education system done this Ren and Martin and you know learned English the way we all learned it and it was that it's part of your thing you know that you write yours obediently or yours respectfully or yours yeah I may not have any regard for you but I have to sign off like that yeah and this is common sense and to make that a national issue just looking for publicity so I


that a national issue just looking for publicity so I think the best thing is to ignore uh stupidity can't be fixed so there's no point so that was one reason I said I'm just done to death with this but I do again no but that again was oh he's running away from the Battleground I mean excuse me I don't want to fight this battle with such people I choose you've had Twitter spats with historians too right well historians not just Twitter's Pat Smitha even courts bats so there's been much more than that but I've always liked to engage with a wide variety of people uh in the long list of video links that I put uh you know on one more media Outlet we had a big face off with Professor Aditya Mukherjee a former jnu Professor with Shashi tharur Dr Shashi tharur in one of the conclaves so you know a lot of historians don't engage in debates and discussions particularly those belonging to the leftist uh you know School of historiography


to the leftist uh you know School of historiography it's my way or the highway there's no it's never a dialogue with another person correct it's always a monologue but I've always had uh you know open conversation with people who have differing viewpoints but then they need to be some standards of discussion and debate if you actually bring the level of the debate to the lowest common denominator and then expect someone to rebut all this uh with people who have not read most of it and you come from a place of prejudice who come from a place of rhetoric I think it's a waste of time three years four years ago maybe I would have said yeah let's do it but now I'm bored of that okay so your book uh Vikram it's immensely readable thank you it's uh it's a lighter read from the savarkar volumes uh outdone myself in terms of the size uh one would think that maybe it's easier to write but I doubt it because uh you know to


but I doubt it because uh you know to get all this uh research material on the 15 people that you code uh it must have been hard because it there wasn't enough research or it wasn't easily accessible right right I mean I think I was corned by my publishers they said after those huge volumes let's do a what my editor premanka goswami called it a quickie uh you know it'll be a quick read so just do this and 15 people the I thought the difficult part was only choosing who the 15 would be uh because you don't know it's more about whom you have to leave rather than whom you're going to select but I realized it was 15 times more difficult than the savarkar volume because as you said there's so little documented history particularly in English or whatever you have to rely on a lot of regional uh you know language literature oral narratives folklores uh all of that but it gave me a great I mean I traveled across most of the


great I mean I traveled across most of the places that mentioned in India and met so many people and accessed a wide range of sources which was deeply Illuminating a lot of them I myself didn't know uh particularly like places like the Northeast which is a black hole I think when it comes to Indian historiography who even knows much about the home homes I was now coming uh all over Delhi there are Holdings now of lakshit we're having his 400th birth anniversary being celebrated in the coming week on I think on 24th of November is now thanks to the you know government of Assam and government of India we are at least commemorating that now yeah uh of course there was a medal in his name in the Army and so on but other than that the larger Indian uh you know mainstream history uh the homes who ruled for 600 years if you ask a little child can you name two a home rajas or one home Raja I'm sure nobody would even know uh so just


I'm sure nobody would even know uh so just imagine the plight of someone coming from the Northeast to say a Delhi or a Bangalore or you know to study and in their textbooks their part of the country is not even represented and you're reading that as the history of India so do they not even matter in the larger Narrative of India and uh what sort of uh you know um Unity are you then creating among people and communities which is the sad manner in which history has been written true Northeast has been uh you know completely uh ignored uh I'm going to get to the Northeast part but before that I want to just know first like how did you select these 15 people before I go to the regional you know I want to go from Kashmir right up till uh you know Karnataka so and from uh from the east from Assam I will come to church yeah so I want I will we will Traverse the course but first how the 15 it must have been hard right yes as


the 15 it must have been hard right yes as I said I think it was more about whom to leave because my criteria were one was of course these are Tales of resistance Tales of Bravery where as you rightly mentioned you know I mean it's not as if we always you know covered in front of invasions we also won Wars so what were these wars who were the protagonists of this these wars making that sort of a list and also I wanted a large the time span so it starts from the 7th century and ends in 1857 with the uprising and then whatever happens after that is the Freedom Movement so I thought that was a good stop and geographical spread so traditionally those areas of India which have been ignored in mainstream Indian historiography the south of India both of us come from the south our stories also don't get featured we are still better off than the Northeast but you know we don't get that coverage yeah only vijayanagar that's it but I'm going to come to


that's it but I'm going to come to the cholas yeah yeah a little bit hardly yeah hardly but yeah go ahead yeah so that was the uh criteria the geographical spread and I think another important point for me was the gender balance again history has always been his story where her story never gets uh the due that it deserves yeah and so uh out of the 15 I've selected seven women and eight men so tried to balance balance that also so geography time span gender and the criteria was you know stories of Courage some are not I mean two of them are were not traditional Warriors they didn't wear an armor and burst into the battlefield uh ahilia by holkar and rajashree bhagya Chandra Singh of Manipur who I don't know even I didn't know this man existed before uh but both of these were civilizational warriors they uh we'll talk more about them later but then they United the con they're part of the country and ahilia by the whole country through culture through through spirituality at a


the whole country through culture through through spirituality at a time when the country was going through a decadent phase and uh you know invasions and all of that so I thought these two were important not just in terms of military courage but also I think civilizationally what were their contribution to this nation actually uh you know when you mentioned earlier by I'm going to come to Alia Bhai but Alia Bhai is thought would be the person I will read first that because it doesn't go chronologically in the book I thought I'll pick up Alia by because you know um curiosity but let's start with Kashmir now it was it was the most revealing thing about it you know when I read we tend to think of Kashmir as one part none of us think that it went right down till the planes so you explained to me or give me a teaser or to our viewers re-read uh listeners a teaser about this yeah tell me about it because I was I was like fascinated I said


because I was I was like fascinated I said I'm telling you this because I'm sure there'll be some comments saying how ignorant she is but sorry yeah most of us Dynasty how many people know how many yeah yeah I mean very few would know at least we didn't have him in our growing up years in textbooks and this man was called the second samudra Gupta of India and kalhana of course in his Raja tarangini paints a very you know fantastic and exaggerated picture of his digvijaya campaign that he made across the entire subcontinent according to him was under kashmir's Supremacy which is a little exaggerated he says he almost crossed Karnataka defeated the rashtrakutas then went to the Tamil land defeated them then crossed the ocean and even conquered Lanka so which is a little uh you know there are no documents to support nothing nothing to you know triangulate that bit but then he had at least still what is today's madhya Pradesh Bengal


least still what is today's madhya Pradesh Bengal odisha um yeah to to some extent parts of you know Assam Gujarat all of that and on the western side Afghanistan uh Tibet so all this entire span was the Kashmir empire under Lalita in the 7th century and we uh never heard of him and his biggest contribution in was the fact that he along with several others during his time ensured that the Arabs beyond that narrow portion of Sindh which they conquered after a lot of effort and dahar's family uh rajada there and his predecessor Chacha who was the founder of that dynasty ensured that the Arabs never you know had a free run he took them 60 70 years to capture after Muhammad bin qasim came and Beyond those little ports in Sindh and so on the Arabs never managed to get to the mainland of India why have we not told this story this is such a fantastic tale who held them back all of these people yeah there


who held them back all of these people yeah there was yes then there was a Confederacy created of so many people bappa raval Naga bhatta pulocation vikramaditya dhanti Durga do even does it strike a bell in anybody's mind these were the people who ensured the Arabs but all of us would know who Muhammad bin qasim is yes and when they the invasion of Sindh happened that is by wrote Every child would know it would be a one mark question in some history paper but who are the people who ensured that they didn't go beyond that narrow part of sin no we don't we wouldn't talk about that so I rest my case that way that you know this is the history that's been handed down to us what's uh what was given to us I think by our Colonial Masters was further perfected by the ideologically oriented you know post-independent historians who uh made this their project as to how the history of India needs to be written so tell me a little


India needs to be written so tell me a little bit about the fall of Sindh yeah and qasim yeah that's a fantastic tale and it's I I wanted to actually do a separate chapter only on Dar yeah because I think right from uh you know 636 CE they've been the Arabs kept trying to invade sin but it was only by 7 10 when that they finally conquered Sindh and that too Muhammad you know there's there was this uh incident of a of a a ship that was going from Lanka all the way to the caliph and that got stopped by Pirates at the devel port and the her did not stop it and so the caliph was enraged and he sent Muhammad bin qasim to invade Sindh and he comes with this huge Army and it takes him a lot of time to actually invade sin but the her is very overconfident and complacent because the in the past almost 60 70 years they've not been able to make inroads I think that was his falling and


make inroads I think that was his falling and he comes in the open battle to fight Mohammed bin qasim and he's killed there and that what follows is a total plunder and for the first time I think the kind of Loot and rape of women a demolition of places of worship uh Buddhist and Hindustan lines is so widespread which probably synth faced one of the first times the kind of Rampage is there and one one of the her's wives is taken away as I mean Mohammed bin qasim forcibly marries her the other one commits uh johar and this is probably the first documented episode in Indian history much before padmavati and others where all the Royal ladies committed johar to escape the clutches of the Invader and the two daughters that's that was again a very fascinating story uh parimal Devi and Surya Devi who are packed off as gifts to the caliph and once they go there they hatch a plot and tell the caliph that you


hatch a plot and tell the caliph that you know we've already been used by Mohammed bin qasim and so we are not pure enough for you and the caliph is so enraged he doesn't even think and Mohammed bin qasim who's having a Victorious lap in India he's he's summoned back to be brought back sewn in a leather bag and so on the way he actually dies of Suffocation and once the news of his death reaches the two princesses they then tell the caliph that they lied to him only to take revenge for their father's murder and then the caliph is obviously enraged and the girls are also put to death but they managed to avenge the two girls despite being in the Harem and the Captivity of the caliph they actually took uh you know revenge for their father's Killers now uh you know you talk about Sati and johar I know uh I'm going to come back to uh I mean I'm going to keep coming to hell yeah


I mean I'm going to keep coming to hell yeah you know like when you talked about the first known johar which has happened in Sindh with ahilia by her daughter commits yeah I mean she didn't but her daughter did what was that like yeah you know my that was that was again a very sad story that story it just it shook me I'm not a mother of a daughter but I'm a daughter I can well understand what it must have been or must have felt or the mother for the mother and she I mean despite all her Petty and her devotion I think her personal life was such a disaster yeah poor lady and the husband was a debauched man this khanderao who had several wives and but what is interesting is the father-in-law and daughter-in-law equation two equation who finds this little girl somewhere and he's so impressed by her erudition that he proposes to get her married to his son and then he takes complete charge of her education her upbringing all


he takes complete charge of her education her upbringing all of that which is so rare I mean in 18th century India the father-in-law actually trusting the daughter-in-law more than his own son and after he dies in Battlefield when all the other eight or nine wives commit Sati he insists that he should not commit because you are the strength and you are the one who's trained in administration and all the politics of the time he's sharing those letters with her these are all documented and kept in the maheshwar archives uh and uh later on her son also dies and he's you know mentally imbalanced so there's no air and then she takes on the throne uh as the queen of indoor much to the uh you know displeasure of the peshwa's uncle raghoba who tries to use up the kingdom but she gives it back to him in style but I think the biggest uh problem for her comes when her only source of Sucker her daughter loses her husband and she decides to commit Sati


loses her husband and she decides to commit Sati and she pleads with her and there's a first person account of how she goes there and literally Falls at her feet and cries saying you're and the daughter says you are going to die in a few years and after that I will be left to deal with a life without a husband so I can't uh this is the right moment for me to take this Noble uh course of you know self-immolation and she goes away and this lady is supposed to cried openly someone who's never given to showing emotions in public actually breaks down and the first person account of a British chronicler who writes that and she locks herself up in the room for several months she stops eating she's yeah I mean she completely gets into a you know sannyas mode after that so very sad tale for somebody who is otherwise given to so much of uh you know charity Petty renovation of so many temples yeah sad personally you can't you


so many temples yeah sad personally you can't you can't go to Kashi you can't go any of these places okay let's talk about somnath yeah talk about the somnath idol let's talk about somnath and what happened there yeah that's again such a fascinating talesmith so when Muhammad of ghazni gets to uh Gujarat uh the chalukya ruler bhim Deva he's you know run away fled and so Mahmoud has a easy run through pattern goes to somnath and he's come specifically to destroy the idol and that's where again the subterfuge that you know modern leftist historians do I don't want to name anybody but then everybody knows who it is uh who keep telling us that this was not for religious considerations it was economic considerations that there was so much wealth in the somnath mandir and of course the the evil Brahmin who is uh you know hoarding all the wealth and all of that there may be some element of truth about the wealth in


may be some element of truth about the wealth in the in the temple but the fact that there was no religious consideration for it is bangkam because this is narrated by all of them right in their Chronicles contemporary and even later they narrate this whole thing that after passing through patan he comes to somnath Temple and he is quite shocked to see 50 000 common Hindus not soldiers of the chalukyan army but common Hindus all armed in some you know manner defending their Temple and their jyotirlinga and this takes him one week to kill all of them and then enter the Garba graha and all the pujaris come running to him and say you are a Lutera you want uh money so whatever money is there in the temple we will offer it to you just take it and leave and this guy laughs and says if I do that I will be famous as a Trader of Idols which I don't want my legacy to be called so I'd rather be called a


legacy to be called so I'd rather be called a breaker of Idols or but chicken and so he refuses the money demolishes the shivling and then it is of course pounded and taken away to Makkah and ghazni to be put on the footsteps of the mosque so that every time a faithful goes on the infidels religion comes down this is Chronicle first person account of the Court historians and today we are providing cover fire for that by saying no no it was only economic considerations and the kind of resistance one is this story of how 50 000 people did this now on his way back he wants to go back to ghaznif quickly after the demolition some of the Hindus try and you know lure him as guides his his he and his entire Army are thirsty they say we'll show you where water is and they take misguide him take him through a dry desert and then he suddenly suspicious and he asked them like where are you leading me to


he asked them like where are you leading me to 2 and then they say that you destroyed our God and so this was our way of taking revenge on you and we want to actually uh kill you of thirst and that's when he finally slays them so this sense of you know Awakening and Consciousness that a a place of sacredness of our you know country of our religion has been destroyed was so Rife and people like Professor Meenakshi Jain in her flight of Hindu deities I think she beautifully Chronicles this whole thing that constantly this effort was there to keep temples were getting destroyed whatever was happening the shivlings were saved they were moving across geographies they were being hidden in Wells in deserts in all kinds of places and resurfacing so in mathura if something is being demolished it would go all the way to rajputana and find a mandir there or go to South India Falls walls in the garbage so that that you know even in Mysore I


so that that you know even in Mysore I I heard that Hyder Ali wanted to break the chamundeshwari idol and so overnight when the priests heard of that they built a false wall and a false deity was installed and he came and you know destroyed that either it knows the nose yeah to defiled the way to see across all the temples in Karnataka yeah nobody wants to admit that you're writing a book on tipu I'm sure that is also going to rile a number of people sucker for punishment so that I'm sure you're researching on that and you know you're going to be coming to those areas where all those temples were destroyed where people were killed in thousands let let into the jungles into the into that thick tropical forest to be killed by The Animals yeah and the the forests were covered I mean we we've only uh as students of uh the central Board of secondary education and ncrt books we didn't read it of any of this yeah


books we didn't read it of any of this yeah nothing I mean from because I'm from Karnataka I've heard from aunts and uncles who've told me this but none of my classmates ever knew and I was called oh you bigoted or you heard this from pujaris or somebody who's told you that's not true and yes okay maybe tipu was a great king in the sense of a conquest he he fought or whatever but this is also part of our history yeah I mean and it's living history uh the story of the Monday mayangas of male kote whom he uh 400 500 of the family who were hanged from trees on deepavali and to this day the Monday they don't celebrate Diwali the mangalorian Christians you come from Mangalore and that side you have the konkanis the uh and then the kodavas from coorg yeah the nyers of Malabar I mean there's so much of anger uh even now Korg I'm told a lot of people call you know


I'm told a lot of people call you know disparagingly they call Street dogs so yeah that's also a living history uh and despite that we do perverse things like tipu jayanti and all of that uh only for modern political you know what banks and uh you know politics so which is sad I mean let that happen uh can't history and politics are so intertwined but I think his as historians as Scholars one needs to put out all the facts I mean this whole thing that if I tell the whole truth somebody somewhere is going to get offended I don't know why that happens when people talk about the excesses of the East India Company and the British no one is saying that it's going to offend the Christians of India right but it was not not the Christians of India but uh it was uh it was said at one point of time right because the the fear that the Brits will say no that that got over but as far as Indian history is concerned there's


but as far as Indian history is concerned there's only been one section which had a control over our Tales over our stories and now there is another lot which is coming out at least I mean you guys were always there who were like you know there are stories of ours of India which have not been told but now there is a voice that you have yeah I just feel that that it's like it's like you've you're writing your text which nobody is reading nobody of consequence is reading but now it's being read I mean I mean their books are totally out of print now it's all coming back into circulation I see the entire RC majumdar's collection available for sale and that really warms my heart because history is a discipline which should thrive on multiplicity of opinions uh to have a single monochromatic narrative and imposed almost hegemonically on the entire nation I think that does great disservice to to the discipline itself yeah and even at the heights of the of imperialism


and even at the heights of the of imperialism when you know James Mill wrote his the history of British India and colored uh India and Indians as uncivilized and that the Brits got us all a sense of culture and civilization and it was obviously a colonial lens of looking at history even uh at that time we had a lot of Scholars particularly from Maharashtra who were putting these Anonymous let you know articles in newspapers called the first Hindu h-i-n-d-o-o the second Hindu the third Hindu who were rebutting James Mill and his uh you know thesis and that led to the Spurt of what is called the Nationalist School of historiography which so the the irony is in under British colonialism we still had a national school VK rajwadi and bhandarkar and so many others jaduna sarkar and others who came that time but post Independence in Independent India they went into ether anybody who does that is a sanghi is a you know communal bigot and all these kind


a you know communal bigot and all these kind of names whereas these are different viewpoints of looking at history it's a very normal course of historiography which in this country assumes all kinds of labels that we are under the payroll of someone I'm I'm I mean I get these kind of tweets I'm like please show me the money honey where is the money coming where is that paycheck which is coming from someone but there is um you see that historians are also you know so sharply divided yes uh right so there's the conservative lot and there is the what the so-called liberal lot and the Liberals are anything but liberal about the point of view of conservatives and of course you know history there is interpretation like in literature there is interpretation so um the the lot which had a Stranglehold uh over the narrative the historical narrative over decades they are feeling threatened by this new lot of history tellers yeah uh it's not new history it's a new way of telling


not new history it's a new way of telling our history finding those lost Tales now they feel that your Hindu supremists like you have said I'm just going to quote who said that you are correcting a biased narrative that has colored persecution of bharat's uh history yeah perception sorry perception of bharat's history is it it's it's it's something that is changing and it's making many of us rethink it's hard Vikram like you know you've what you've learned in school in college once it's embedded in your head to be told that what you've read is wrong you have to be open-minded to accept it it's hard to do that very true very true right I mean uh as you rightly said those growing up years your teacher is your idol and what your history teacher has probably told you in school poor thing I mean not his or her fault they were just teaching what was there in the syllabus but to know that a lot of that is concocted uh you


that a lot of that is concocted uh you know history has written extensively on this how when he was a part of the uh the ncrt committee uh then the the the national curriculum policy or whatever that was there it was specifically told that uh anything that is inconvenient truths should not be mentioned National integration Council or something they had a circular that came out saying this is going to harm National integration and you had that Infamous circular right which the West Bengal government I think 1989 uh brought out there were two columns called and ashuddho where all the textbooks of all the uh you know across classes of West Bengal under the leftist regime there any mention of invasions ghazni gauri aurangzeb that came under ashuddho and the shuddha version was it all had to be taken off you can't mention all this because it's going to affect today's society I mean why why would you want to hyphenate today's Muslims with uh with an aurangzeb and a


Muslims with uh with an aurangzeb and a ghazni your idea should be to tell today's Indian Muslims that they are not your role models and they are not someone you need to look look up to as your icons your you are actually hyphenating them and tell and to do this you're fabricating history whitewashing the crimes whitewashing the genocides the destruction which has happened over 800 2000 years so I don't understand where this need comes from to make a community feel secure you need icons of the same community and to even there if you do I mean a dharashiko is a better role model than an aurangzeb so you don't need uh people who will come and tell us from outside India the famous Infamous biographer of aurangzeb that he protected more temples than he destroyed yeah right I mean Hitler also protected more Jews than he killed so these kind of crazy you know nitwits come and become the voice of scholarship has no mention in at least when I


scholarship has no mention in at least when I was and I'm good you know when I knew that I'm going to be interviewing you yeah I got all these textbooks because you know I mean my thing goes back to when I was in school and uh after that when my children were in school and there was nothing and I've said this before uh in in interviews and podcasts and everything that you know um all we knew was that the South Indian kingdoms was a choice question and it was a three month Choice question so if you didn't want to top your class in history the three marks you could avoid so cholas we could just completely ignore vijayanagara architecture so that two marks you just learned vijayanagar architecture hundred percent it is coming so that most people read the kunji the guide and learn about architecture it's like you know like when you're reading about harappa you know Harappan civilization okay let's read about the seal yeah one question will come on the seal yeah right