don't we send a petrol to the bridge to see if there's anyone there we sent a patrol we found the bridge abandoned pakistani's had left and gone back to Dhaka there was a telephone there so one of those telephones you revolved like this so the reply came from the other end headquarter Eastern command here at headquarter Eastern command means headquarter Eastern command Dhaka not India yeah sure so uh Brigadier Claire said can we speak to General nyazi please who's calling he said we're from the Indian army had been in college together in law old friends so Nazi came onto the phone and he said hello he said Abdullah is Abdullah Abdullah this is where are you he said I'm at mirpur Bridge we are waiting to come in we are hearing manic shows request for you to all surrender but we are not receiving any reply we are not in touch with anyone he says I have already given orders to my troops to move into the barracks and to be ready to


move into the barracks and to be ready to surrender we are ready to surrender but we don't know how to inform India and the Indian army that we are ready to surrender we I don't know how to respond to manicure's speeches so gandhar said well we are here so he said what I'll do is I'm sending General Jamshed in a car about 20 or 30 of you come in I'll send you six cars we'll meet in the operations room and we'll discuss here so the six cars arrived with a flag flying which flag flying the general jump Shades but this could be a trap could be a trap but then at that time soldiers take a take a chance isn't it could be a trap but we said we will we will take this risk so we got into these cars because by that time have you called back headquarters you haven't you take the decision there you took the decision General nagara took the decision we're driving in uh with General Jamshed asking the driver


driving in uh with General Jamshed asking the driver what is that he says the university and what is that that's the race course so we get into headquarter Eastern command and a young officer comes out maybe staff officer to uh analogy he said General nyazi is in the office and Brigadier clear walk in I'm just along with them they Embrace each other he says hello gandhar we say hello Abdullah how are you unbelievable how are you so he says we have we have lost the battle I've ordered the troops into Barracks they're all in barracks but I don't know how to inform you all he said well we'll come to your headquarters and we'll continue trying to get in touch with India what's his body language like General niyazi is he looking dejected depressed they were expecting the seventh fleet to come they were expecting help from Pakistan dejected he was feeling let down that West Pakistan has let them down what was his like you're saying he got up and hugged yeah and


you're saying he got up and hugged yeah and he's what did he say old school boy friendship you know okay uh really then we caught him was he armed he had his revolver yeah okay we were all armed okay um so somehow or the other from his office through one of our channels we managed to get through to shillong passed a message there to General Jacob Chief of Staff to say we are already in Dhaka we are sitting in nyazi's office he is ready to surrender but he doesn't know how to inform you and we are not in touch with anyone either so he said let me tell the Army Commander so we spoke to General Aurora and they said Jacob said I'm coming down by helicopter I land there and then set up a meeting between General nyazi and me the General Aurora also came no dip for the surrender no no surrender hasn't taken place yet hasn't yet yeah so set up a meeting for Jacob and um so the two of them sat in


Jacob and um so the two of them sat in the office and they had a power and he said we are ready to surrender so so then I'll ask my Army Commando to come down and then between you and the Army Commander you sign the documents of surrender so it was decided that 431 430 surrender ceremony will take place at the race course in Dhaka all the 90 000 troops there will prayed General Nazi will hand over his revolver to General Aurora the troops will put their weapons down and surrender and then the surrender ceremony will take place for which General Aurora arrived for the surrender ceremony General Arora General Jacob Naval gentleman RV designed the surrender I was there and then you were there when the surrender yeah I was there yeah okay we were all good uh with Nazi and all at that time then what was the mood in the troops who have to put down there very sad and dejected and but what can you do some Victors and


and but what can you do some Victors and some are vanquished so did they expect to be uh taken care of as per the Geneva conventor did they actually think that be Massacre no they hope that Indians would keep them they were more frightened by anywhere we must say about 500 they were frightened that they would be lynched because they had committed genocide there so they were frightened they'd be lynched by the muktibani yeah so surrender ceremony took place they laid down the weapons then went in for a cup of tea did you hold did you have to hold back the muktibani and that too you had to my God throughout while we are in Dhaka we didn't allow the muktibani to go near any of them they would have killed them they would have killed them you couldn't stop them no but you could understand right yeah they had seen that people killed raped looted bloodied everything Village after Village I was placed in command of one of the prisoner of


was placed in command of one of the prisoner of war camps yeah so I said let me talk to the officers so they all lined up and I went around meeting the officers and I said I'm Colonel Brar he said I'm so and so so and so so and so I said don't worry about your War but you'll be looked after under the Geneva Convention they were looking up like that till I came to a particular officer he's looking down so why don't you look up son so he looked up he was Colonel Akbar of the baluch regiment who he and I did the Staff College in Australia together in 1965. I said Akbar he said Bulbul I said I'm sorry today you're the one question we are the victors but you're wearing khaki uniform I'm wearing olive green uniform we are both soldiers we are both fighting for our countries and we are friends as soldiers now first of all give me the phone number of nazreen your wife in Lahore let


phone number of nazreen your wife in Lahore let me ring her up and tell her you're going to be safe you'll be home soon and this that and the other and in the evening we'll have kebabs together so that I rang up nazreen she answered I said nazreen this is just calling to tell you Akbar is with me he is okay we are going to have kebabs together this evening please don't worry all that in the evening we had kebabs together amazing you know what it is to be a Vanquish Soldier because you were there in the 62 world yeah yeah you know what it is yeah it is so uh war was over uh they all laid down their arms and I stayed on in Dhaka till mujibo Rahman came back you know Rahman had been arrested and taken away uh sent Away by Pakistan he never saw the war no he never saw the war that eventually the UK gave him a royal Air Force Comet plane and flew him


a royal Air Force Comet plane and flew him down to Dhaka he arrived in Dhaka at the same airport and everyone was there thousands and thousands of people you know and what a welcome he got yeah arrived but those memories don't go away easily you know I I I can still see myself standing in Darker mujibo Raman and all this yeah in fact when we were entering Dhaka Joy hind joy joy joy Hinds fantastic it was yeah but there you are just a life well lived any regrets when you look back in your career I can't even say career as a soldier but your life as a soldier no regrets uh I knew I'm going to be a soldier when I was five years old I saw my father as a major general every morning wearing his uniform and I said there's a way I want to go into I want to join the Army I want to join the same regiment the morator light Infantry and I I was born to be a soldier


and I I was born to be a soldier and carried on my life and that life still carries on my only regret now is I'm getting old every day and I'm no longer young and um you're 89 years young you have amazing memory and you you explain chronologically exactly what happened in 71 and Operation Blue Star so hats off to you and wishing you health happiness always and be safe thank you very much it's a pleasure speaking I I need people like you thank you for watching or listening into this podcast do like or subscribe on whichever Channel you have seen this or heard this namaste foreign [Music]


I fundamentally believe for every political party its time has to come 10 years of Moto G if you are not able to bring BJP in tamilnadu how will you bring BJP is expanding now we are in the expanding phase we are having a booth President we are going to all parts of Tamil Nadu we have lost a sitting General Secretary of the party was hacked to death outside his home by Islamic fundamentalist till now we have lost more than 100 karyakartas so from the outside perspective for people who say tamilnadu is a very safe State Tamil Nadu is a state where Terror exists what the way DMK is trying to do it they will try to make it uh again they will try to play the Delhi versus Tamil card that is the only card left in their Armory they don't have any other thing for them they have created an impression of Delhi Asaf in Delhi some four or five Roberts are sitting inside a room and they want to loot each


inside a room and they want to loot each state and take money into it you put a shoe on the t-shirt and a jeans pant you walk people call that isra I think padiator is not that padhyatra should have a larger purpose Madam it is not you are angry with modiji you want to do it you're angry with this you want to do it lot of media especially from Delhi is focusing on the governor speech but you have to understand what happened before the governor's speech the governor was made to feel unwelcome they spoke ill of governor in the will of the house they say the governor has added some lines to it and give it his own speech he did not add a single line of his own this watch is something which I wanted to wear because the watches of the Rafael cockpit a party in power is asking a common man show the bill which of course I am showing April the day I start my father yatra I try to push some


I start my father yatra I try to push some things very fast I am not like a traditional politician or a lot of things to mature I want to put more firewood and and cook faster but right or wrong that is my style foreign welcome to another edition of ani podcast with Smitha prakash today my guest is Anna Malai kuppuswamy the State president of the BJP in the southern Indian state of Tamil Nadu annamalai hails from The karur District in Congo region of Tamil Nadu he's an engineer holds a master's degree in Business Administration from the Indian Institute of Management and then became a police officer in 2011. not content with a successful eight-year stint in the Indian Police Service annamalai joined the BJP in 2020 and within a year he was appointed the president of the state unit animal IG you are emerging as one of the sharpest young politicians in the country whenever somebody talks about young politicians who are going to matter in by 2024


politicians who are going to matter in by 2024 your name is taken uh in that um in the South the BJP has not really managed to make much inroads over the past several decades since its existence um you were seen as this white Ray of Hope by your party in Tamil Nadu so what is it that is your brief and what are you expected to deliver in Tamil Nadu uh thank you so much Madam for having me in your podcast so I fundamentally believe for every political party its time has to come whatever we push and pull certain conducive factors has to be there for a political party to emerge if you look at Tamil Nadu for a long time we had big stalwarts there uh people like jalalitha Madam people like yeah they're like very very people people bigger than their shoes uh people who can pull crowds uh people just thought they can't do any wrong that there is a kind of confidence they generated very importantly Dr MGR now what has happened


very importantly Dr MGR now what has happened in the last four five years we see a lot of vacuum in tamilnadu though a lot of parties are fighting for that space and they need a larger than life leader kind of tamilnadu people are always used to this kind of an impression you need a larger than life freedom so now our honorable prime minister Narendra modiji exactly fits into that role one nine years into governance all the central government schemes are reaching that maturity level people are seeing in their own eyes the transformation Tamil people generally takes little bit time for them to get warmed up uh if you look at Dr mg or himself he acted in movies for a long time he was in DMK for a long time then he started a party in 1972 five years later he came to power there is no that instant hero in Tamil not they take they take time to warm up to you once they warm up then sky is the limit for Modi G people have


then sky is the limit for Modi G people have warmed up to him they have accepted him they have seen him for two different elections now so 2024 we fundamentally believe modiji is going to fill the big Wacom in Tamil Nadu that's how I see it the brief is very clear madam to spread the party the party has to go to all parts of tamilnadu 39 Lok Sabha constituencies we have to go around everywhere the party is traditionally strong in some parts of tamilnadu we are strong in kanyakumari where we have produced MPS we have given MPS coimbatore we have given MPS trichy we have given MPS so now we have to spread out tier two cities to the Village level that is the work we are doing as of now see um for uh for our viewers and our listeners who may not be very familiar with Tamil Nadu politics uh this like when you said about this Larger than Life many of the people that you mentioned they came in


many of the people that you mentioned they came in from from the glamor World they came in from uh film industry or karnan they was not exactly from film industry but he was a poet and you know he had this uh interaction with with the crowd and all that and everything that we see in about Tamil Nadu politics is huge posters and then people getting very emotional about their leaders and all that it's politics is very different from the rest of the country isn't it I partly agree with you madam it is true we are definitely rest different from the rest of the country and uh the initial part of tamilnadu 1919 the Justice party came to power in tamilnadu um until 1947 uh with with the British control we had some form of a government post 1947 we had some of the great stalwitz in tamilnadu you look at iconic Statesmen people like Raja gopalachari people like Karma Veera kamarajaraya that was a different era in time so those people occupied


was a different era in time so those people occupied the Mind space 1965 post the Hindi agitation and tamilnadu things took a sharp U-turn till then it was more like a tamilnadu was part of the national mainstream and rajaji was there part of the national mainstream kamaraja Ayah you know part of The Syndicate and very big leader so tamilnadu was never far away from India it was always connected the schemes were coming and people were dictating up to the Delhi politics also people sitting here were dictating Delhi politics 1965 posed the Hindi agitation and the sharp U-turn that happened Tamil Nadu was seen from the outside as a state that is slightly away from the mainstream India in terms of politics where it is separate politics it doesn't matter who's coming in Delhi there are people vote very differently so that a very careful political wake-up which arosed after the Hindi agitation the DMK party smartly captured it all said and done he was also a great


it all said and done he was also a great person in the media industry in the SEMA industry he wrote screenplays very powerful dialogues for n number of movies for which Dr MGR acted as the hero and the connection for them they all came together annadurai who was the first Chief Minister of tamilnadu the dravidian chief minister 1967. he was also very popular writer and a speaker so from then onwards it is one after the other it is like that it is going um but we all have to understand Madam uh the Larger than Life leaders uh the shelf life once it is over it's a matter of time for them um the parties go through some sort of a struggle because the next leader can't match up to their standard and nobody could match up to kalinga's standard nobody could match up to Dr MJ standard but generally Madam came up because she was also came up the hard way now in the current field I don't see any Larger than Life leader in Tamil


don't see any Larger than Life leader in Tamil Nadu will occupy that mind space and people simply will blindly trust them he cannot do any wrong that is the kind of image people had for them so in this space the politics is going to be very very different not the old style of politics now while I I'll agree with you that you know the larger in life figures era might be over as far as Tamil Nadu politics is concerned and you are saying that it's it's Modi ji even I'll come to the language issue later in the podcast but when we are talking about Larger than Life figures I it was said when karuna nidhi passed away when uh that you know a he is different that era is over his progeny will never be able to have that kind of but since Talent won and he's there and he didn't have that kind of an image he didn't have that kind of a fan following but he won how come he managed to capture that Tamil


he won how come he managed to capture that Tamil Nadu generally when parties come to power ma'am you see a sweep a Lok Sabha elections also you see one-sided sweep that normally happens in Tamil Nadu when previously when you see this kind of a transition between DMK and admk in each of the election in a five-year cycle you see a good number of seats 140 150 170 up to 182 we have a 234 member assembly and this election was the most closely fought election ah DMK came to the election with the 12 party Alliance uh the net difference between the DMK Alliance and the ADM kalens was a matter of 2.1 percent total load share and the 45 seats which the ADM kaliants lost if you count the margin it is 2.4 lakh so if you if you do a very nuanced analysis of Tamil Nadu politics it is all becoming very closer parties are vying for that space and this itself is a sign that you will not see a


itself is a sign that you will not see a sweep anymore in Tamil Nadu like generally The Sweep karnality sweep MGR sweep that was the Lok Sabha and assembly performance so 2024 has given a very clear indication DMK despite 10 years out of power 10 years they were in power and 2019 they had a big sweep because they were able to generate some sort of a wave in Tamil Nadu 2021 was very close very very close as I said the numbers if you look at it very close one so I would say that clearly points to a new emerging Trend that people will see politician as a politician they will see who you are what you are speaking what are the other parties and everything and they will not blindly trust you okay 10 years out of power please give her a chance that was the whole time and Tamil politics also ma'am traditionally the position parties never play a big role in tamilnadu four years they keep quiet uh fifth year they


four years they keep quiet uh fifth year they emerge they issue some paper statements they do two three quarters before the election they sweep so that is also tamilnadu will not see that was the trend for the last 30 40 years you will not see an aggressive opposition in tamilnadu you haven't seen for a long time so this splintering of votes that you're talking about or the splintering of um loyalty uh maybe uh towards the political party if that is happening since 2019 uh so you are going to change that Trend you in the sense the bjp's decided to take advantage of that splintering and not wait till the next election isn't that what the the way I look at this for a party to go go ah it we have to have a very clear presence in the Grassroots that is very important we have about 68 000 booths you got to have a very strong presence in those booths now BJP is expanding now we are in the expanding phase we are


now we are in the expanding phase we are having a booth President we are going to all parts of Tamil Nadu till then it was always a problem for BJP when these two major leaders were there you never got people for the booths because people are addicted to some sort of a political phenomena for the first time we are seeing our boots getting filled our president's slot getting filled so it is more on the expansion side the second problem for BJP to immediately fill up the Gap per se is you are taking on an MLA contestant from the BJP who's a five-time MLA invariably in admk when you see it is all five time fourth time six time mlas who are there now ADM also DMK also the same thing where there are matured politicians and 30 40 years they are in politics for BJP we are seeing lot of first generation young Dynamic people getting into politics through BJP this is the trend we are seeing in the last two three years okay so I would


in the last two three years okay so I would say 2026 would be a marker 2024 you will see BJP emerging in tamilnadu where we will send a huge number of MPS to Delhi because that election is going to be modiji is going to come to come back as India's prime minister how much is Tamil Nadu going to contribute so we see a clear way for Moto G in 2024 so what's your immediate goal 2024 or 2026 2024 the immediate goal is to make sure the party is strong enough to capture this wave a wave gets generated to con to translate that into votes votes we got to have Booth level presence so you have a wave right now you think I see a wave Madam I see a wave clear promotive wave unlike last time in 2019 where they generated because one after the other when you see what Moto G has done if I can speak very elaborately about it modicity is seen as an Insider in fact if you look at the Tamil news


in fact if you look at the Tamil news for the last one month somebody has started a rumor that modiji is contesting from Tamil Nadu one of the seat everywhere you go people ask I was two days back I was in a tea shop in thoothukudi I was having a tea in a tea shop the Anna asked me Anna is a pure modigable contest so this has become a talking point contest from Tamil Nadu from ramanathapuram is what the rumors say so people have picked up that rumors medias have written columns about it Varanasi and ramanatha Modi is connecting it is all a rumor but people are commenting people are talking people want more digital control that itself is a sign this and many other things that modiji is seen as an Insider in Tamil or not anymore an outsider from distant part of you know that that's something which is an anomaly no because in Tamil Nadu there is this whole what is your identity is it a Tamil Identity


whole what is your identity is it a Tamil Identity or a national identity that becomes very important it's they've never tolerated Outsiders tamilanda parity I don't mean it as a criticism but I'm saying it that's the truth that uh you've not seen uh you know anybody uh coming in from outside and contesting an election in Tamil Nadu isn't it that's partly true Madam because a lot of Tamil based identity caste identity local dribidian identity a lot of things goes into people deciding in their mind whom they want to vote but since modigia has transcended everything probably I think is probably the first Outsider outside Tamil nobody has done it even Indira Gandhi as a second seat she picked up from Andhra Pradesh she picked up from Karnataka when she wanted to Sonia Gandhi picked up from Karnataka Rahul Gandhi has gone to Kerala nobody is daring to go to Tamil that is why I was very confident now when I say this ma'am if


very confident now when I say this ma'am if you look at the current new space this has become a talking point that itself is a sign that Moto G has transcended everything so 2024 would be a very different election so you think that uh but see it's a state election uh the BJP did this even in Bengal they had you know they said that Modi magic is so strong it was strong in 2019 in the sense that the vote share became very big in uh in West Bengal it was becoming the it's become the second largest party of after the TMC they did that but state election is all about State leaders how can modiji get I agree with you madam modiji can generate that wave for you it is very important the state leadership and the candidates who are there in that correct mind frame you should reflect the qualities of modiji for example if you're talking of a state election it's very important the candidate selection is perfectly bang on them you put correct candidates all the


perfectly bang on them you put correct candidates all the social engineering whatever you want to do but more importantly the candidate should reflect the qualities of The Honorable prime minister the party should set a correct narrative and go for example how is modig seen in tamilnadu Moto G's seen as a development person unifier mortgage is seen as the first person probably the Prime Minister whichever person president whichever higher constitutional position you take the first guy who took effort to reach out to Tamil people consistently in the last eight years ten years even winners Gujarat CM this is the image of modiji the party has to reflect very carefully with the very calibrated approach when we do it both think if the party takes some other narrative locally in tamilnadu then we will have a problem the mortgage is Magic translating into words this anatoman that we have to do the hard work modiji can create that wave for you as he said in 2024 we see a wave but important thing in the next


we see a wave but important thing in the next 16 18 months they were working like like a war now put people in the booth make sure they know what election is they know which house to go whom to approach they know which voter is voting for us go talk to them make sure he's ready to work but get his vote to the polling box so this is something which we have to do which modiji can't do for us as a prime minister I get that uh but you know the BJP has traditionally always worked with an ally in Tamil Nadu right uh whether it was vajpaiji he had very good relations with uh with jayalalithaji and then even Modi ji had very good relations with uh with jayalalithaji so it's always worked through another Avaya media if I may see now you are making this uh you know in all your uh speeches in all your public interactions it's the BJP you don't talk about allies you're talking about an identity creation of the BJP


you're talking about an identity creation of the BJP and identity creation of modiji in your speeches in your interaction now also it's only BJP no Ally I keep telling this in Tamil Nadu also Madam we are not against any party per se there are respectable Alliance leaders Alliance parties at the same time we are very clear BJP has to become strong it's it's a it's not an alliance of convenience like what DMK does with 12 parties cast parties and everything here it is Alliance of respect though we and admk officially we have a lot of disagreements or many issues officially um language issue we want a three language formula to be taken up they want a two language formula they oppose the new education policy we want the new education policy to come so a lot of policy issues as a party we differ but since it is based on a certain principle we align together DM admk also respects it so I keep telling this BJP has to have an identity of its


this BJP has to have an identity of its own in tamilnadu this is the time when modiji's image is all time high when we go to rurals area rural area it is no more a house it is Modi house it is no more money it is Modi PanAm people have already started talking us as a politician as a BJP carrier my job is to connect it properly to translate that into words so once we do that the alliance parties will also start respecting us it is not that they don't respect us but we believe even when we sit at an alliance we should sit with strength that is our belief you sit with respects it with strength so that you do politics there not because they wanted to give you some seeds five seeds or seven seeds or whatever it is you contest on their back this is something we want to change the public impression also public have somehow got this impression in their head that this Alliance this party is very strong this party is not very strong


party is very strong this party is not very strong we want to break that that is why in the recent uh local body polls we contested alone we want we want to put the party under stress test we want to see where this party is going can we put 13 000 candidates do we have the ability to put 13 000 candidates first time after many many years our karyakartas were doing their Booth work full time because normally when you have an alliance in in Lok Sabha in assembly the bulk of the election load is taken by the alliance parties because they have an established structure so BJP never had the opportunity to learn politics at the ground level this local body elections was a great opportunity where our people did politics they know first time they went to the ground level they had a notebook they know which house to survey whom to talk then they came back and said oh Modi this image is great great I'm entering this for a long time his image is fantastic in tamilnadu only


time his image is fantastic in tamilnadu only thing is we have to do that connection and make sure that translates into votes I'm we're always told that language is a big issue in Tamil Nadu identity language identities is very big which is true Tamil language evokes a very very strong sentiments and this has been the case for decades why is it that that doesn't work when it comes to Modi ji he speaks in Hindi he doesn't speak in Tamil why is it that you think that there is a connect that the people have with Mr Modi in spite of language being an issue or language not the same not an issue but the two things to it ma'am it could also be seen as uh if you take 2019 as a barometer 2019 Lok Sabha sabharameter 2014 when modiji contested for the first time for the Prime Minister post Tamil Nadu BJP stood alone we formed an alliance of our own but though we created the alliance the other parties contested more


we created the alliance the other parties contested more seats than us because pmk contested more other parties so there the combined vote share of the BJ parents was 19.3 percent all Alliance that was the historic number for us where we were able to win one seat on our own in kanyakumari also the DM case lowers toward share was recorded in 2014 they were at 23 percent so they were only four percent more than a Reliance One this clearly shows when 2014 the whole country was like oh modiji is coming mortgage is going to change and we want to go for more disease that way wasn't tamilnadu in 2014 else you will not get 19.3 percent and one uh Lok Sabha said contesting alone with a like-minded small three-part parties there 2019 what happened the DMK was very clear from 2017 onwards they run multiple TV channels they run papers and everything they run radio channels all as a party as members belonging to that party they carefully set a narrative from


to that party they carefully set a narrative from 2017 the anti-modie wave which they claimed go back Modi and Twitter which they organized they created an impression that uh the jalika told this that everything though we brought but they created an impression that BJP did not bring BJP was not careful for the Tamil sentiment now last time when modiji visited Tamil Nadu Madam last time last time when you visited madurai the vanakkam Modi just to give you a number how it has changed now you wanna come in Tamil Nadu means welcome Modi in a historic India's record the Prime Minister hasn't got or any political party hasn't got a Twitter train that is 14 lakh for a day so PM got Wanaka Modi for 14 lakh the go back Modi was around 70 000. now you see a very clear shift in public perception that oh once we have been fooled by a very calibrated very networked very a proper structured negative communication now people are thinking I want don't want


negative communication now people are thinking I want don't want to get fooled now that is that is the thing that is working now so 2019 I would I'm always telling Mom it is a very artificial kind of election and Tamil Nadu and 2014 also we have to understand why BJP could not win more despite getting 19 percent generally The Madam made it an election between generalita versus modiji she called it lady versus Modi she said it is me or Modi G so they gave an impression as if a million is going to become a deputy prime minister so they created an impression so people naturally thought okay there is a chance for jayalalitha to go up to Delhi and they had an impression now 2019 they kind of created an impression that when the whole of India believed Modis is going to come it gave a historic mandate but Tamil people they created an impression that Congress is going to come they create an impression it is all an impression that is


an impression it is all an impression that is the only worry the party the the structuring that we are doing is we don't want because we don't have a TV we don't have a paper we don't have very organized communicative approach we are we are also getting used to that okay how to break it how to break that narrative when the TV runs stories after stories from morning till evening you have a big sun TV you have a Sun News you have a calendar TV all big trp channels worn by the family per se or murusali again owned by them then you have multiple radio channels owned by the Marin's family so people got bombarded by everywhere you see here they were getting bombarded with this Theory now with a lot of of calibrative approach we are breaking it we got good amount of proper influences in the ground level who tell this story no this is false this is not happening so that took a lot of effort so it is more like a green shoot madam what


so it is more like a green shoot madam what happened in the local body poles was a green shoot where bjps would share in the contested area was about eight and a half percent notice a green shoot in local body pool that happened six months after DMK coming to power so we are very confident this was the problem in 2019 we know what was the problem that is why you see the current politics of DMK Madam whenever they get into the back foot immediately they make it Northwest or South immediately they make it central versus State now they have taken Governor as more like a mascot for Delhi they want to make it Governor versus DMK meaning Delhi versus DMK so DMK tries to play this game very carefully because they know they can't win on development politics they are trying to again reignite that passion and pride whatever they have been doing for a long time two topics are variety one is about the communication and two is about the governor issue I'm going


and two is about the governor issue I'm going to come to the governor issue uh later but first let me talk about the communication thing uh it's it will seem a little strange for uh people who don't know much about Tamil Nadu politics because mostly people think that bjp's communication management is probably Leaps and Bounds Beyond anybody else I mean any place critical party you talk to whether it is the Congress or whether it is the TMC they'll all say all channels are only speak about modiji only talk about BJP everybody is go the media every it's only the BJP BJP BJP but what you were saying in Tamil Nadu it is completely different but why is it then that oh you don't want to play that same game like you're saying that the other political parties have their own TV channels but you don't want to bring out your own TV channel is it the BJP I think the party is very clear Madam ideology party doesn't want a TV channel to propagate


ideology party doesn't want a TV channel to propagate what it is doing instead they expect the karyakartas to go and do the hard work meet people because it's it's a fairy they can create for five years but this can never be a permanent thing so the party has always taken a call you go and do the hard work what is expected of karyakarta let us not get into businesses which you are not supposed to get into it so Tamil Nadu do our cadders every time as senior leader from Delhi comes even to the Prime Minister also some of our party members have said sir we want to start a TV channel so whenever he comes they keep telling you give us a TV channel but they are very clear that political party is not here to win every race and and say that every day I'm doing right I am doing right every day push narrative that is never a role of a political party it's just to have that people connect so they say we keep we expect you to


connect so they say we keep we expect you to do that people correct you go to house sit there be one among the people start talking to them then things will change and TV channel is just a figment of imagination where people say you have a TV channel you win but the problem Madam in Tamil not more than a TV channel it is the carefully constructed negative news fake narratives in Tamil for example a sun TV channel would play some news from up now because now up and up are the favorite for them up and MP something happens in up they pick that up thing they put it you see the yogiji government this is happening in up that has got nothing to do with Tamil Nadu politics that news has got nothing to do with yogiji government also it is some strange issue somewhere so cow got transported somewhere some vigilante fight between two different groups not connected to government government would have taken action also now the new thing is they played out in wherever DMK party is in


they played out in wherever DMK party is in power the same thing should not happen in Tamil Nadu so be very careful so then they take a seven o'clock debate they put a first time I see very funnyly the debate is happening for issues outside tamilnadu they pick up nuises from across India where you must have seen very recently during the Gujarat polls one of the family party was carrying a live kitten Gujarat they were carrying a live kitten Tamil areas of Gujarat they are meeting Tamil people to say do you like dravidian model of development or do you like Modi model of development in the live all hundred percent they are saying it is Modi model of development in Gujarat Tamil guy is living there they didn't know what to do to cut it also then the anchor was trying to come in which became a troll material now this is something because since they are ruling party now for what what was working for them when we were in


what what was working for them when we were in opposition for 10 years for DMK everything was anti daily anti-center antimony now since they are ruling party people are angry with them they didn't want to project anything within Tamil launch so first attempt they're coming outside tamilnadu picking up a Gujarat or picking up a up trying to play it sentimentally this is a neutral the BJP model which they are saying is not working as compared to the Tamil Nadu model which is working you're right model they want to do that comparison and bring that fake narrative inside because every five years they change that status so since the BJP doesn't have a TV channel of its own in Tamil Nadu you're saying that Twitter Trends will work for you as far as the narrative building is concerned Twitter is a small part of a public discourse I just gave that number to tell you how things have changed but with Twitter Twitter nobody is going to win an election with Facebook nobody is going


going to win an election with Facebook nobody is going to win an election YouTube but but what I'm trying to say ma'am like I said we have to spread and have presence in 68 000 booths that is what we tell people is that your brief as State president yes Madam to grow organizationally to put Roots be present everywhere what happens when many a times somebody in some house in some Village is willing to vote you don't have an organizational presence the traditional parties they do a transportation for them for elections also where they get that five is seven percent extra voters even people who want to vote for us since we don't don't have an organizational presence they make they convert the door to their party because they give that last minute push to them correct so our job is to just go around tamilnadu make sure we put roots and very importantly Madam in Tamil not unlike other parts of India a booth president of DMK is a booth president for 30 plus years next time


a booth president for 30 plus years next time when you come to tamilnadu the ground level when you see a booth president of DMK he will be an old man of 74 75 years 30 years is the booth president they will not change because the state party president doesn't change is one family the district presidents are there for 20 20 to 25 years because they are the mlas the ministers and District president so what happened this guy especially the booth president he puts a route there so he is the guy who helps them for daily issues he calls the police station he goes there he comes there so our BJP we have a very different kind of politics we want to give opportunities to everybody nobody's permanent in the party we keep Shifting the leaders so our guy has got a problem especially to Tamil Nadu politics where those people stick dravidian model the booth presidents are there for 30 35 years we are trying to figure out this we have to break this


trying to figure out this we have to break this also by saying that new people once you go there we have started a program called recently we said each has to take care of 25 houses in his locality any problem in that house you are the first responder like a cop there is a rainfall issue go there solve it there is a central government loan issue go there solve it don't work like a party take ownership of that house so I'm very happy to say as of now there are about ninety thousand karyakartas engaged in it each person has taken twenty five thousand twenty five houses going around because the only way to break that logic is our guide taking ownership of 25 houses because we don't have a model where every household will know he is our booth president for DMK call that fellow picks up a bulb but for BJP and National parties we have this problem competing with the traditional dravidian Regional major because sometimes you have to play our game differently also Madam trying to catch


play our game differently also Madam trying to catch up with you when you are hunting for tile Talent uh when you're hunting for this booth level when you're hunting for district level what is it that you're seeking is it youth is it new ideas or is it somebody who's established you break away from another party what is it that you're seeking I fundamentally believe uh the people who are slightly more resistant to change are people who are seeped in a particular way of Tamil Nadu politics many people are network they say this will not work Larger than Life image will work so those people have seen ravidian politics for 30 40 years the first timer the second timer is willing to change 18 plus till about 45 guys is willing to change willing to experiment so those are the guys coming to BJP in a big way at the same time the party we are admitting outside is also in a big way the party has to expand there's no other way you


the party has to expand there's no other way you have to bring Outsiders but at the same time ideologically when a party from a six percent seven percent you have an ambition to go to 25 percent because you have to jump four times likely meaning you have to bring Outsiders in more number when the internal gelling is not happening we see a lot of places it creates artificial friction then people go out once you lose an election people don't stay for the long term so it's a big laboratory experiment that is happening we are bringing Outsiders in a big way we are pushing youth also giving them positions of importance same time doing simultaneously Manpower training simultaneously getting them to mature much faster because every day we tell them you are competing with a five-time MLA any of our aspirant way I tell them we are competing with a five-time admk MLA or a DMK MLA who is there for 30 years in the constituency he has got face value he has done


constituency he has got face value he has done work as a minister now unless you do something different you will not have a chance what is his image is Great Wave is there Moto G will bring you 50 60 percent of votes there is 30 40 percent we have to get it by our phase the Party symbol in everything so wishful people be more like a social worker political party is okay is okay that is why the 25 houses Theory we want them to go mingle with the house and start behaving like a social worker so you were talking about the the messaging so the messaging for a long time has been that the BJP is an anti-drividian party now if that continuously is hammered at times that message must be sticking you know I I'll tell you recently the Hindu newspapers editor Malini partha Sati she did a Twitter poll in which you know it was asked what is more important they said that this 50 more than 50 percent I think votes went for that the Tamil identity is


I think votes went for that the Tamil identity is stronger than the national identity now that is that's a pretty strong thing it is probably you'll see that in Bengal and you'll see that in Tamil Nadu which is happening and the BJP is seen as a party that is trying to break that so where are you or do you want to break that what is it is it a wrong perception this poll Madam if it has happened 10 years before probably would have seen 80 20. now we are seeing 60 40 or 55 45 that shows things are progressing uh maybe 1970 do I mean 95 fire something like that Madam so I see this Pro poll as a very a barometer which is showing that ground is Shifting once you cross 50 55 then we would call National Party Sierra so in a way I partly agree with you madam that this poll is indicating something ground is Shifting 2019 if you've done the poll with all the center anti-center anti-modie whatever we DMK was generating


center anti-center anti-modie whatever we DMK was generating would have been different how long does it take for an anti BJP I call myself a darker dravidian okay I call myself a dark dravidian the media people ask me sir you are dark that is visible but calling you a dravidian how do you substantiate I said look it's a land of panchatravida if you look at the old literature we call panchatravada panchatravada right up to Gujarat the current Pakistan what happened this fellows a land mass of the dravidian was converted to a culture converted to a people converted to a boundary before 1956 what do we call as Tamil or Madam it was a Madras presidency going all the way to Orissa going all the way to Maharashtra Mysore this way we have cotton we have come so it is a combination of many culture and many things before 1956 even a Madras the name itself has come from come from a Telugu ruler even if you go to Chennai


a Telugu ruler even if you go to Chennai now people say a good number of population in a very Higher Side they speak Telugu Telugu origin the first 12 people settled in Madras now this is a new Theory they have started from 1956 calling this boundary in Tamil movie we have this vadivela movie you don't trust this line I don't cross this line the quotation they say after this line if you can't come and I won't go no I won't cross I won't cross this line but you don't come inside this line okay now this is DMK style this line is the ravidian line the geographical geographical boundary which is never the case this is something they have given a narrative to it in the last 30 40 50 years they say now dravidian means which which is a shrinking area inside Tamil Nadu moment you cross Tamil Nadu border which was the Earth's 12 Madras presidency where our cheras cholas and pandias ruled where our great Kings went where people still


ruled where our great Kings went where people still have relations settle the other side of the Border this is something which I say look I am also a dravidian by this logic of landmass and I am a sixth seventh generation born this person a farmer so this is very important for tamilnadu because we also have to speak a language which people understand and moment revision we get into this race and culture and Boundary then it becomes very tough matter secondly the second part also Madam bjb very conveniently they make it a Delhi Century party or a regional party for them the first branding they do is a daily Centric party if a Delhi setting party comes to power their interests are always towards Delhi not towards Tamil not for them they've created an impression of Delhi Asaf in Delhi some four or five Roberts are sitting inside a room and they want to loot each state and take money into it they don't understand modiji has come from Gujarat an outsider in pure


has come from Gujarat an outsider in pure terms coming to Delhi because it is an administrative capital in the people's mind Delhi is made as if it is some robber barons are sitting in Delhi they will loot Tamil Nadu take our resources if you go to a village that is an impression so for us the problem I'm simultaneously we got to grow the party strengthen the organization break the narrative Set current narratives we all have to do it simultaneously to get that but there were two uh two prime ministers from dravidian States if I may say call them that I mean there was David gowda and there was a nurse they were there NTR played a very a major role in National politics at one point of time getting the janatha party together and uh you know that the whole front together opposition so it's not as if dravidian leaders have not paid but somehow Tamil Nadu is gets very uh Angry with it and you know that that sentiment has been


with it and you know that that sentiment has been taken over by Rahul Gandhi when he said in the parliament also that the BJP will never be able to from he pointed out that from Bengal to Orissa to Tamil Nadu to Kerala and even at one point of time Karnataka you will not be able to even enter this region he said uh talking about Regional leaders in these parties in these states who are going to prevent the BJP storming lower than the the cow belt area which is called you know yes in the parliament but I I welcome statement in the sense I said only if you say things will happen Ulta in Indian politics whatever you have said it has happened Ulta I said for BJP to come to power it is important ragul Gandhi should have said that statement because he said it without understanding Tamil Nadu politics a state maybe for his grandmother and a great grandfather in the initial time when the power transition was happening from Britain to India


the power transition was happening from Britain to India Pandit jawaharlal nehru asked chakravarti Raja gopala how should we shift this power is how should we give a narrative that power is getting shifted and rajaji gave an idea in Tamil Kings he used to carry the single scepter I will make a scepter in Tamil Nadu bring it to Delhi we will give it to mountbatten so he will give that scepter to you we will collect it and we will show there is a transfer of power technically the transfer of power happen in photograph wise the scepter was made we can keep giving lot of connections Madam right up to kamaraja now he has to understand Tamil Nadu was always a land that favored nationalism because you see a state that far across from the epicenter of what is happening in Indian Politics the Delhi and Mumbai and other things the quality of Freedom Fighters it gave it is like far beyond a state that is in


it is like far beyond a state that is in the hinterland of India far beyond it has always got that it has always got that now he has to understand Tamil Nadu has behaved in a very different way because it is people like that who chose to do politics inside Tamil not even I've seen Congress inside tamilnadu they speak a dravidian DM case language for example neat congress party opposes neat in Tamil Nadu congress party opposes new education policy in tamilnadu whatever DM cases Congress is it that is why he called Congress in tamilnadu as dmk's beating because ideologically they don't have a different standard it is very unfortunate Rahul gandhiji somehow beliefs it is by parroting the statement Congress has got a life support in tamilnadu but we chose to see it some other way that we have to just regain the glory get that narrative right moment we get it going it's a matter of time Tamil Nadu will get rid of the


of time Tamil Nadu will get rid of the national mainstreamer the Congress has never had an issue being the B team of the DMK isn't it I mean never in the sense I'm talking about 15 years now they don't have a problem because they're not ambitious Madam they don't have a problem innocence ambitious in the sense for any political party the reason for its existence is to come to power BJP for Tamil Nadu were very clear the party has to come to power only then ideology and whatever we have to do we can do for people but very surprisingly I see in Congress for example a senior leader like Peter Alphonse very similar to Congress he says the only person who can save India he says is MK Stalin he doesn't say Rahul Gandhi I question them sir you are such a senior leader in the Congress the number two in the party you are giving and the talking in the press that the only person who can save India is MK Stalin you're conveniently


can save India is MK Stalin you're conveniently forgotten your own Rahul Gandhi so Tamil Nadu it's we see in the ground now MK Stalin for them has become more Superior than ragul Gandhi including the State president because they keep pirating for them they want that bit of mlas to show that they are existing in tamilnadu and for them I can give you an example Man 2014 when Congress was standing in some constituency and 2019 when they aligned with DMK their votes had tripled somehow they have this false notion aligned with DMK will come back to Power that is what Congress is like I don't think it bothers Mr Rahul Gandhi so much if there's a cult following for uh Stalin isn't it I find it very funny because the way both of them behave madam foreign G to come and flag off very conveniently what he did this he called aravind kejriwal to kejriwal G to Chennai a day before arvind kejriwalji was


Chennai a day before arvind kejriwalji was in Chennai a day before the start of Bharat jodo yatra cm and arvind both inaugurated US Government School upgradation in Chennai next day he went to that program he told them I have some throat infection I can't give speech at all but I will do flag off so very very clearly MK Stalin G placed this double game Congress is weakening weakening weakening moment it crosses beyond that limit where we can't Salvage itself I will throw this out and align with somebody else that is MK startling this calculation as of now Congress understands this they go overboard to catch him now Rahul jio he goes over body understands the strategy of MK Stone he's like MK Stalin is great and Tamil Nadu DMK is great this was not Rahul gandhiji's stand in 2019 2019 he never came to Tamil Nadu for canvassing Madam I'll put it on on record 2019 canvassing not even a single stage


on record 2019 canvassing not even a single stage were together he came for canvassing for congress rally he never stood in the same platform with MK Stalin G because somehow he had this aversion that 2G scam and other things he didn't want to align with them and other things now Rahul ji completely conveniently he has become a biggest cheerleader for Mk Stalin which is very unfortunate but so now tell me 2024 is Modi ji versus talent and 2026 it's going to be annamalai versus Talent I'm 2024 Madam it is going to be modiji and Indian people first time we are not going to see verses in Indian politics it is modiji Indian people people are voting okay that sounds like uh no no I am not sucking that reason I'm telling you madam what stature does MK stalini has got what's teacher to compare to motiji what stage what's nature but if you speak to the DMK they'll say of course in Tamil Nadu


DMK they'll say of course in Tamil Nadu Stalin has a bigger stator than Modi ji Modi ji is in Delhi he's in Gujarat he is in many other states but Tamil Nadu has a style of its own which is Stalin for the DMK people it could be for an average tamilian they cannot accept this fact you can take our chief minister MK stalini compare him to Modi G and do it that can never get if if fertile DMK is doing that will be the single greatest gift they will be giving to BJP Tamil Nadu if they are doing that comparison I think we start with 10 percent plus well I think even OAC said that when uh asada was in the podcast recently he said the same thing that if it's going to be Modi versus somebody then it's Advantage BJP so 2024 should not be Modi versus anybody the opposition strategy should be that everybody fight on your own and post election then maybe see something but don't


own and post election then maybe see something but don't fight it as Modi versus it works to bjp's Advantage do you think Tamil Nadu will be the same Tamil Nadu what they will try and do madam what the way DMK is trying to do it they will try to make it uh again they will try to play the Delhi versus Tamil card that is the only card left in their Armory they don't have any other thing because they can't showcase their achievement it's 20 months already not even 20 of full promises are fulfilled so the only thing they will try to rack up some emotional issue that is the only plant they have Hindi Hindi will be an emotional Governor whatever they try to do Madam but Tamil peoples are smart enough not to make the mistake that happened in 2019 because they believed in a false narrative this time will not happen so you're seeing no pushback I mean we are seeing it on social media we are seeing it in conversations


it on social media we are seeing it in conversations with uh tamilians that we are having about the Hindi pushback they are scared that uh you know if if the BJP still has that image about being a Hindi imperialist party you don't see that pushback at all when when you interact with people Madam I don't see that pushback because for them the image of BJP is through the state leadership if you go to Tamil Nadu I would Hama 100 people if I ask how many people know India State president I don't know Hindi many of us don't know Hindi we speak in English with broken Hindi whatever we can manage we speak like a typical tamilian who don't know Hindi with broken Hindi whatever negotiation we do in the airport railway station we come out so they see it and second we are all sons of the soil we are properly grounded it is not that janakrishna motiji many tamilians know now a hardcore tamilian was BJP National president of


a hardcore tamilian was BJP National president of BJP National president one point of time now I believe madam there is no more this Hindi thing will work because normally when modiji speaks in a language for for DMK it is easy to say CC mode is speaking in Hindi mode is speaking English now they want what is DMK wants modiji to speak in Tamil then they'll say Okay Moto G is for tamilnadu but what has happened people have understood stupidity why should he speak in Tamil if he's doing for Tamil till 2019 was like dmk's argument modiji should speak in Tamil to prove he's for Tamil Nadu as stupid an argument DMK kept now the ground level Spirit has completely changed they are like see this guy born in Gujarat in Delhi for no other state he has done something for Tamil nados doing this Kashi Tamil sangam that is why they have taken the governance issue I know you're getting into Governor by now


issue I know you're getting into Governor by now they should have taken Delhi versus Tamil Nadu there because of Kashi Tamil it is Governor versus okay so I am going to come since you're going on mentioning the governor issue it's become such a thing the BJP uh let me first talk about just the governor's issue whether it is Delhi whether it is Telangana whether it is Kerala whether it is uh Bengal the governor versus an elected representative government elected representative which is the chief minister it's become governor versus Chief Minister in many of these states and uh the the accusation against the BJP is that you're politicizing the role of the governor so now let's come to Tamil Nadu the recent fracas which happened it was it was embarrassing it was awkward it was terrible which happened uh but the the lines have been drawn very strong now between the governor and the chief minister so where do you see this uh


the chief minister so where do you see this uh going for the party I see a trend Madam it is initially they used to take on Modi G all of them are understood taking on Moto G nobody is going to win in India yeah all these leaders whom you have mentioned have understood very smartly they have understood you can't take on motiji now they have to have some rules to take on that ruse has become the governor they have taken on governor no and in indirectly they want to attribute by taking on Governor I want to convey a message Delhi is trying to remote control and do something in my state we are losing our identity we are losing our this thing so let us not happen this is the image that they want to build foreign ERS different points of time we had this Governor is an outstanding professional outstanding professional person born Bihar served in Kerala again got back to IB in nagaland Governor there came back to tamilnadu you will not see a


came back to tamilnadu you will not see a qualified person has traveled across India Northeast South Delhi administered to Capital domain expertise so his vision is generally very broad Vision he has got whenever we talk to him he has got a very broad vision for the state now DMK somehow they want a very playable Governor where you give something government will sign the whole thing started with neet was the first rubbing point between the state and the governor they said you have to sign Governor said there is a problem in the sense Supreme Court has very clearly said this is a correct law I can't go against the Supreme Court then they started CM said I will not participate in any function I will not come for at home reception he did all this drama now it is with the president of India Madam the neat whatever resolution are simply passed then every four four month they waited CM was saying that the outstanding Governor very good for the state these are the these are the


good for the state these are the these are the words he used on the stage for four or five months then the second rubbing happened madam when Governor used the word called Tamil Nadu tamilagam that was a recent uh fight governor in an informal setting to a set of audience he said I prefer to use tamilakam he never said nobody should not use Tamil Nadu he said I prefer to use tamilagam I suggest you also to consider this what he said if you ask me as a person as a person anomaly as a person what do you use I prefer to use both Tamil Nadu and Tamil because I've been using it for the last many years so those who don't understand can you please explain the difference between the two Tamil Nadu Nado means generally a country Nado in generally means country India not it's called Indian ornaments country of India in literally would be inhabitants of an area now Nado is in the colloquial term okay but Tamil


is in the colloquial term okay but Tamil Nadu means it is basically the land of tamils if I can do a rough translation a place land of tamils people might carry an impression that this looks like a separate state for an outsider to understand Tamil Nadu Nadu means Tamil favorite country Tamil people we call our status Tamil Nadu we call our countries indianado so not a means country means a place of tamils so this but not technically nothing much but what happened DMK in the last 20 months Madam couple of statements they made I think which must have irritated the governor on dmkmp made a statement the conditions that existed in 1965 for demanding a separate state are existing even now I am warning central government this is one DMK MP CM was sitting in the stage then one DMK spokesperson he said Tamil Nadu is always separate it will be separate or DMK official spokesperson so we have met Governor we have given memorandum to


we have met Governor we have given memorandum to the governor saying this MP should be disqualified because he's going against the worth of the Indian constitution different times so DMK the moment uh the chief minister took power he started using a word called wondrous means how India was formed the DMK believes Hindi India was formed by the American way where all states states got together got together and formed a country so he says we are like no it is India is always meaning a central government where State never fused together and formed a country country was there 1956 we divided based on the the boundaries were divided based on the language we speak it is not that we fuse together to become India so this also has irritated Governor when on record he has said that he doesn't prefer the word called undriyam gives a feeling as if it's a sub subunit of something it has to be Madia so there are some nuanced politics behind this Tamil Nadu Tamil so Governor


behind this Tamil Nadu Tamil so Governor suggested you please consider Tamil as a word he never imposed anything he never said Tamil Nadu is wrong also he said this is the connotation Maharashtra your word called rastra Rajasthani of Rajasthan Telugu desam desam you have everything gives some kind of a connotation Tamil Nadu but since DMK is not at Clear till now the CM hasn't come on record and say Tamil Nadu is part of India we all are together there is nothing called separation nothing called this nothing TM chief minister hasn't clarified till now for whatever is MPS have spoken that's a different matter madam same I don't see any difference in it because I understand I understand the spirit behind it the governess thing was more to the people who believe Tamil Nadu is separate the second third confrontation recent is the assembly one when the governor was invited he went there even before he started speaking lot of media especially from Delhi


he started speaking lot of media especially from Delhi is focusing on the governor speech but we have to understand what happened before the governor's speech when the governor is about to talk except the DMK all their Alliance parties they rushed to the will of the house they spoke ill of governor in the will of the house they said you have to apologize for Tamil Nadu tamilakam and you you mentioned Tamil nakam which we don't agree and the speaker allowed them to come close to the governor if you look at the image man the governor is with the mic they are almost some what two feet away from the governor they were citing it was allowed for full four and a half minutes then speaker very reluctantly the marshals were called all the people are pushed out the CM was sitting in the first row with hands folded watching this in front of his eyes all this Alliance Partners Congress did gero thrown out not thrown out after four and a half


thrown out not thrown out after four and a half minutes they walked out the vck dmk's alliance partner Communist Party DMK salience partner then the governor was allowed to start the speech you have to understand that context map it was very tense environment the governor was made to feel unwelcome if you look at the images of what happened the moments before the governor spoke the speaker sitting in his chair not even condemning the member standing up and saying all of you keep quiet or get out because the governor's address the rule is very clear man nobody can interpret this is much different from the other days of the house where members interpret in governance address it's very clear people can't interpret because immediately the punishment is much more severe by throwing you out by suspending you for more time in other times Interruption can be called as fundamental right to Speech but here it is not that then the governor started a speech governor gave a speech that the governor was


governor gave a speech that the governor was waiting for the national anthem to play on the national anthem place the governor's speech is complete the governor will walk out they didn't put the national anthem I don't know purposefully then the CM suddenly stood up he passed a resolution saying whatever the government Governor has spoken today it will not go into the assembly's record first time in Tamil nadu's history then immediately the governor walked off now DMK is setting two narratives in this one they say the governor insulted the national anthem the governor never insulted the national anthem they insulted the national anthem by not allowing the national anthem to play and CM he broke the complete decorum of the house by speaking something out of context in front of Governor saying that whatever you have spoken will not go into records thirdly they say the governor has added some lines to it and give it his own speech nevermind the governor it is true he has you


nevermind the governor it is true he has you he hasn't used certain words the DMK has given but he did not add a single line of his own single line of his one for example which I completely believe what governor did this right in one place they say what governor omitted the Tamil fishermen who were arrested in Sri Lanka they got repatriated back only by the efforts of Tamil Nadu government this is the line the governor added one due to the efforts of Tamil Nadu government and central government what is the wrong element in case the governor has an added central government the governor is doing a constitutional disservice which means he is himself admitting the state government can take control of the external Affairs relationship it is central government which brought the fishermen back of course tamilnadu chief minister would have written letter to our external affairs minister the governor going with the Constitution added what is the constitutional's correct position DMK saying no no whatever


the constitutional's correct position DMK saying no no whatever we should have given you should have read it the next line they are mentioned Tamil Nadu as a state is a safe haven for peace just now we had an Isis Bomb Blast we had a police Constable molested during the DMK function by DMK party functionary governor in his conscience he said he's not going to read it he never told it in the open that is what we are given to understand because Governor maintains a studied silence he didn't read that one line the next Trend they say no you insulted ambedkarji you insulted another insulted them and all Governor never insulted them in that line the dravidian model of development was there but it was like a political line they said the Vigor The Valor and the great March of dravidian development model apparently you were given to understand Governor has said please remove this three adjectives rigor Valor and March I will read the other things because I can't speak


will read the other things because I can't speak like a political person I will he does not have a problem with reading dravidian model of development but the words before it glorifying Tamil Nadu glorifying the chief minister by adding adjectives to it government said I'm not reading this line since the state government did not agree to that government skipped that entire pair of not even one line Governor added on his own madam now any sane political Observer will say what government it is right if Governor would have said only tamilnadu government brought back Sri Lankan fishermen it is against the Indian constitution it will be against many things and very importantly we are finally seeing a governor in Tamil Nadu with a lot of Concepts every Governor had conscience I'm not putting anybody down madam but is having lot of conscience he's saying okay I am going with you the Council of ministers have got Superior power I'm not questioning it but be very reasonable tomorrow DMK in the next


but be very reasonable tomorrow DMK in the next governor's address I've thrown them a challenge you will add online saying Tamil Nadu will separate from India very soon and you want the governor to read because you're quoting the provision of the Constitution saying governor has to read what are the Council of ministers have prepared that will be an absurd logic matter yeah the governor has to apply his mind see it is not it is invalidity with the Indian constitution and read it that is why the DMK in the back foot now after the governance issue where people are angry with them they're trying to play this Tamil Nadu only now so uh you know you were talking about uh writing certain things and all that but it became more than that it became more than the speech of the governor because then suddenly you have somebody from the party who turns around and says go to Kashmir and you know then Omar Abdullah says what are you trying to say now


Abdullah says what are you trying to say now Omar Abdullah is ideologically close to Stalin as compared to with BJP he didn't like the idea that his state is being pushed as a Haven for uh you know terrorism and send it send him like saying send to Pakistan sent to Afghanistan send to Kashmir so it's become very you know this cooperative federalism we keep talking about now it is like every unit every entity trying to insult the other by saying these kind of things very ugly uh madam the DMK party Chief MK stalini is our chief minister son udayanithi Stalin during the Assembly election in 2021 he made a statement Modi G because of his torture he killed Arun jatliji and sushma swaraji the statement given by udayanithi we are given a complaint to the election commission and everything we have given a complaint if I recall the DMK top leader speaking like this I should not say this in the podcast when Indira Gandhi


say this in the podcast when Indira Gandhi Madam post emergency when she came to Tamil Nadu she was tone pilted in madurai she got got cut and blood y was asked Madame Indira Gandhi got a blood what do you think I should not say this on record said for a woman blood disc coming what is new in that it happens all the time DMK as a party it has got a Rowdy image in tamilnadu for a woman will never vote for DMK always jail modiji now the kind of utterances they do is like you cannot even hear modi's mother gets insulted like anything every time modiji goes and meets her mother immediately the DMK it even and somebody will tweet photo opportunity he went for photo all crap they will write madam so nothing new in the political discourse of it is before maybe for the first time uh many Delhi Medias picked up but many times this news gets very localized it doesn't come out of tamilnadu people always say are


come out of tamilnadu people always say are they are like that only just so do let us go to the next work but at the same speech what you have seen madam not only that fellow abused the governor he abused my mother it's the same speech the same speaker after abusing the governor he said how did annamalai's mother gave birth to annamalai something he said but I am also used to their attack last three or two months two years I am seeing their kind of attack it's a it's a 40-minute speech if you take that speech per se the DMK person minimum 20 Affairs you can put who was sitting with them 2 mlas the State Health Minister was sitting in this page listening to the full 40 minutes they walked out then we thought the only way we can put pressure on the tamilnadu policies we have to put a subtitle to that speech and send take it across India the subtitle was put by our team our bjpi tubing we took that speech put


team our bjpi tubing we took that speech put the subtitle send it to all of you in Delhi to all the editors we said look this is happening in tamilnadu the poll is in 48 of us it's not registering an fir that once it became a big issue it became a national issue then people understood the context of Kashmir and wanted that is so if you see my Twitter feeds them often I put a subtitle and post it the only reason I want the news to go beyond Tamil Nadu for people to understand what is happening the punishment till now till today is suspension from a party for some time no fir if I go one step below behind that one week back Madame kanimoli was addressing a meeting in Chennai have come to give security to her DMK meeting one fellow molested a woman police constable then we said we said look we have a video we are going to release that video you better book an affair and take this fellows out


better book an affair and take this fellows out we know their name also I called for a press conference I said chief minister you do it there are two things one she is a woman second she is a Polish woman third she is there for your party function fourth the chief guest of the party function is your own sister you do it then 24 hours Noir 48 hours we said two days we are going for a dharna after 48 hours they booked an fire after two days they picked that guy took him to the police station called the two month Constable ask her to withdraw the complaint that's the drama then BJP workers went and got out the police station then late night arrest happened at 3 30. I'm just giving an inkling inkling like this because madam when DMK knows it is in the last leg it is not fighting in its ideology I'll give it to him right or wrong that's a point of debate Madam we can sit across the table and two leaders can


we can sit across the table and two leaders can fight with ideology fought with ideology 1961 62 he said Tamil Nadu is going to be a separate country right or wrong he mentioned it moment we brought her Constitutional Amendment we said any political party talking of secession the political party would be banned immediately another in Parliament said okay we are not going to speak about secession but we agreed to be part of the Indian country but the conditions still exist we will fight for our rights right or wrong Madam with those people you can sit across the table and talk because we are ideological different your conversations can happen but current DMK dispensation without the intellectual brain or somebody it has become more like a macro party where the first thing is abuse filthy language and the poor governor was who wants to serve our state first time is hearing all this when Governor along with this Madam visited a temple in tamilnadu he was not wearing a shirt because the


he was not wearing a shirt because the tamilnadu dangawastram the culture is there in Temple immediately the DMK it being took that picture and put a troll then our ITV had to call their writing fellows and said look if it is not stopped it is going to get personal because we are not governed as Pro we are DM BJP party as citizens of the state he is our governor personal vilification personal attack the poor Governor he maintains a studied silence at least we speak the governor clearly believes his job is not to speak he does his work he travels across Tamil Nadu he speaks he doesn't come to Media doesn't talk why he does what he does and everything but somehow DMK thinks the governor not speaking means they can speak whatever they want that is the most unfortunate part so this these uh attacks on your mother on your personal attacks does that hurt you do you feel at any point of time that you didn't sign up for


any point of time that you didn't sign up for this when you got into politics my mother let me very Frank with you madam my mother they live in a village Madam uh we are a farming family my father and mother take care of the farm we have sheeps and cows there and they have to be there for daily feeding and everything now since the character assassination and personal attack on me has gone overboard I told my mother not to stay alone wow she's staying at my sister's house which is about 20 kilometer away in a city I said take care of Mom because I don't want her to get mentally upset because we are used to this in politics they keep all kinds of things because my mother when something she reads she's not even in a position my father studied till 10th my mother studied till sixth class they are proper Villages my mother anything story that comes about me she's not in a position to differentiate whether it's a true news or false news my


whether it's a true news or false news my mother have put her in my sister's place saying please take care of her don't allow her to be alone so these are all big losses for me in the sense that personal space is gone privacy is gone just a few days back when the central government gave me a zip category security uh which is unheard of in Indian politics where a state president of a party in getting at a 37 year old who's not even a panjayat member who is not even a elected person anywhere given a z category security that is a level to which Tamil Nadu politics have come I have taken a call I've come into this fight and I have ideologically it is now or never there is my mindset 10 years of mortise if we can't do it now we can never do this my mindset 10 years of modiji if you are not able to bring BJP in tamilnadu how will you bring because I personally believe there is no more leader who is


personally believe there is no more leader who is going to come into India with more dishes service but like one generation Avatar purusha it comes this is I'm not saying as a karyakarta I'm saying as an Indian citizen he motivated me to resign my job and come he in the sense I never spoke to him he as a person I said my state also needs cleansing if this guy is there when you can't do it which time you will do I came I resigned something I came under doing something but the losses are huge in the sense character assassination vilification they pull my parents pull my father and everything but I have to understand madam it is more like a bhagavad-gita here I keep telling it is always on the process just keep doing that process without expecting the result what I am doing the results might come five years later 10 years later for somebody for the party leaders at that point of time I'm okay with it but here I am very clear let me keep


it but here I am very clear let me keep doing this as a party take leaders along with me not focusing too much on the result because you focus on the result my mind is gone because this is a state though I am very positive and very optimistic with respect to what has happened but you're taking on very powerful forces media money uh they know very true to politics like what you currently said any point of time they can switch on emotion switch off emotion they can play the cards very well because they're used to it for the last 60 70 years I'm like first time politician first generation politician two years into politics every day is learning every day is fighting so it's very tough it is not very easy but good thing is when you have leaders like Modi ji Amit shaji nadaji are Delhi who clearly understand what is Tamil not because it's it's important people sitting in Delhi should understand better our top leaders should understand hundred percent backing they are giving if it is


hundred percent backing they are giving if it is not happening then you will not even survive in tamilnadu party they'll just push you away and Anime you spoke about resignation and how you got into you know like you decided to resign uh from your job so I'm going to take you back uh into your past but before that you know when you're talking about getting into politics and all I've heard about so many reasons why people get into politics you know so I would want to know why you got into politics but before that you are an engineer then you do MBA then you join uh the Police Service after upsc you join Police Service and then you go to my home district and then you know so now my question is why karkala you left because I remember at that time you know uh my relatives saying oh we have a singam in uh in Karnataka now and you leave all that and join politics I believe even the chief minister then told you that


believe even the chief minister then told you that don't do it or reconsider it so what is it it's a long story my man but uh I will tell you madam since you've asked this question um in Civil Service when you get into government service Madam in the Indian civil service it's purely by Fate you get a state I don't have any connection to Karnataka just by choice I got Karnataka with Tamil Nadu there was no vacancy for me Tamil Nadu was option number one Karnataka was option number two I went to Karnataka I don't even know one line one word of Karnataka or kannada randomly in karkala there was this nuxil activity happening at that point of time they wanted some young SP so there were six of us randomly they said you go here you go here I went to karkala because the Western got very beautiful and I think the greatest blessing for me Madam the greatest blessing for me in my life I would say is


for me in my life I would say is getting into karkala especially Udupi district for my first tenure in polishing what a great people the quality of people God fearing people who believe in punjabutas people who live a life very quietly cartilage a small little sleepy town you the place you are born very highly cultured so those things made me as a person I was able to take my time first one year eight months and car class asp though I wanted to get transferred maybe the first time in karnataka's history they wanted to retain ASP in the same district as ESP then I got posted as the same district as SPS promotion again karka was in my jurisdiction that went on for two and a half years meaning for more than four and a half years I was in karakland as a public servant madam then slowly I was more on the coastal side I was in chikmagalur uh we can say some more like Coastal Karnataka the people are very different very very God-fearing


the people are very different very very God-fearing somehow I am also very spiritual guy for them spirituality is part of their daily life you see this Buddha Cola you see this you could now global stage now correct yes but people who lived there will know how it is intrinsic part of their lives people believe in that spirit then it happened to Bangalore but somehow Bangalore I felt I was it was very suffocating for me it was a person um I felt it was more becoming protocol day by day where uh you beat VIPs uh Karla was you meet poor people somebody come to your office they say Anna this land issue is a problem come and sort it out or not this issue is a problem you felt you were one among them Udupi was like the Chipmunk lovers like that but Bangalore was more I felt anybody can do this anybody can do this protocol why me and I am not seeing the value of my work getting translated in the ground I'm more in the air


getting translated in the ground I'm more in the air and that was small is slowly churning in my head but I never had the courage to resign I never I know I'm a middle class boy that monthly salary has to come for me to make that monthly budget if I quitted what will happen luckily I got a trip to kailash manso over that point of time so it was a long trip government of India I was a licensed officer for one of the R3 batches so away from cell phone for 40 50 days up in the Himalayas so that gave me a very cluster Crystal Clear Clarity that I have to do something in the Grassroots by which some difference can be made I can see visibly that somebody's life is getting changed by my work there so annamalai goes to kailash mansarovar I think everybody can get the meta for those who understand it anyway go on so came back Madam I prepared my family prepared my father prepared my mother prepared my wife because we


my father prepared my mother prepared my wife because we are a very young kid three and a half four years old so I prepared everybody took about three four months I said look I don't know what I'm going to do but we'll figure out the plan you got support middle class families next month he was like wife was like you do it okay if it gives you happiness you do it I don't want you to be an unhappy policeman she's a non-political non-political she's a software person huh father and mother is like don't do it why are you risking uh father is like what will you do after this I said I don't know let me very Frank with you I don't know what I want this is my this is what I told my father is it great take one to three years take five years ten years you work maybe you quit at 45 50 you come out then normally when you quit Madam uh I I happen to meet uh somebody from the BJP party also uh uh It


somebody from the BJP party also uh uh It Again by chance Again by luck who introduced me to this party in a very deeper level as a policeman you see the party from the outside it is not that you go very deeper into it an invariably 10 politicians you see five six are always bad Madam when they come into the office you see that their other side of life also as a cop so for me all politicians I somehow felt are the Shady characters doing deals and everything I never had this good impression of a typical cop in my book also mentioned this madam then I thought the introduction to the party the orientation was very different to what I've seen this I wanted to start an NGO politics what to do which gives more impact which will maximize what I want to do took about six months of eight months of started an NGO called we the leaders Foundation more into Skilling organic farming ran it for three four months by the time after Equity became one year the


by the time after Equity became one year the influence of this people was very strong on me that I should come consider Politics as an option because they can accelerate what I'm doing in an NGO much faster the two BJP the two BJP Tamil Nadu because every because those people need it though the video readers Foundation was in tamilnadu focusing on three four districts which I felt we have to we have to make a change so I would say many a time it is like it's a purpose it's a calling Madam a lot of people ask me I say let me be very honest I will not tell you lies as if I planned as if I approached some party as if I sat with them as if I resigned as if I came I said it never worked like that in life it will never worked well when there is a purpose the purpose will always meets its master when you have a purpose to do good to make some change to people there will be a master of the universe


to people there will be a master of the universe somewhere both will connect that is how we give advice to people so keep your purpose intact if you want to get into politics I ask them why answer why if it is power I say don't come you might not get power through your life so for you it is to transform people's lives or get modiji elected um or both together for me again I see Madam if if anomaly is some MLA somewhere more important than that is modiji because with him it's 100 times more faster the change will happen so right now the goal is to get modiji elected again because you want to see this transformational again effect going much faster not because you can be that one MLA somewhere or one NG or somewhere you can do that one place somewhere inside but coming into politics my mind has become much more broader now it is like you think you can do 100 times more than the other guy motig can do thousand times more than


other guy motig can do thousand times more than who we are so the larger impression is to get more elected now again and again so you were talking about you know going to the grassroot level getting talent and getting at the booth level and all so is this padhyatra which you're planning from April one of those uh one of the one of that the goals for one of that is that is the main goal Madam because it we are planning to start a year before the election uh those times we believe fresh Talent will come in and those will comfortably give one year to the party because when modiji came in 2014 we found a lot of professionals came that point of time they all came new into politics we want to generate the same spirit and tamilnadu we are saying give one year you don't like politics it's okay give one year to motiji you're from U.S you want to take a break come for six months to tamilnadu you are you are walking in a


to tamilnadu you are you are walking in a corporate role in Chennai but not afraid to come into politics afraid to come into politics come six months so I believe this would be a catalyst to kind of recharge politics at the local level which is completely away from the traditional Tamil Nadu political mold you need money you need to pay 2000 rupees for each vote you've got you got to have star power we believe we can we can break it by this but then um everybody is going to say you're copying Rahul Gandhi and fragul Gandhi thing what has happened now it has become Madam you put a shoe and a T-shirt and a jeans pant you walk people call that is I think padiator is not that Madam and yatra is not that I fundamentally believe it is more going meeting people with a larger purpose Rahul gandhiji after walking this many kilometers on one of the interview I saw I have traveled so much


the interview I saw I have traveled so much across India I haven't seen hit last one I've interviewed I haven't seen Delhi he said I haven't seen it then why did you start the padyatra in Tamil Nadu when Raul gandhiji started we said there is no hit why do you want to waste your time instead you want to call this a walking competition you do it we don't have a problem after 3200 kilometer he says no hit but padyatra should have a larger purpose Madam it is not you are angry with modiji you want to do it you're angry with this you want to do it congress party is weak you want to do it no it is have a larger purpose here you want to redefine Tamil Nadu politics itself he's uh he says it is uh in in the midst of hate it is Pyar Ki Dukan he's opening up places where love can be distributed through his padayatra what are you trying to distribute in your padayatra


what are you trying to distribute in your padayatra it is to properly connect modiji uh number one Madam to all the rural audience second to strengthen the Grassroots and third to find enough number of volunteers professionals who will give one year to 2024 because 2024 is going to be a very important election like like what you said initially 2024 happens 2026 will happen so I see both are in a long journey both are Milestones matter animalizing you um you know you were talking about uh your privacy going in a way because now you have this security uh which the government has given you um what for those who don't know why it happened could you just tell us that what statements of yours it was it was about it was about Islamic Terror endurance PFI and those kind of comments I really don't know Madam but being a ex-cop people Target you for a n number of reasons I don't know why it is why security agencies have picked up some alert some threat what


security agencies have picked up some alert some threat what is the intelligence input nobody shares with sure and uh in India we are emerging as a Nation member it's a nation we are emerging and uh we are we are many of us when we put ideology first and talk very vociferously you you you tend to get into wrong people's mind right it always happens that on a state like Tamil Nadu we have lost a sitting General Secretary of the party was hacked to death outside his home by Islamic Fundamentalist till now we have lost more than 100 karyakartas BJP as a party at different points of time but were all murdered and killed and anything especially because they put ideology first for what they are doing so from the outside perspective for people who say tamilnadu is a very safe State uh Tamil Nadu you don't see this lot of problems and others Tamil Nadu is a state where Terror exist modules are very strong Isis has got a very good presence you have


strong Isis has got a very good presence you have seen on coimbatore now even before that a wannabe truck bomber was picked up in Salem he has already purchased a truck he wanted to run it procession he was just picked up after he purchased the truck so no more Tamil Nadu is that state where everything is peaceful everything is great tamilnad has become very ideological State also especially in the last many many years Tamil they see um people want us we have parties in Tamil Nadu Advocate a separate status of now they contest in elections also we have parties like DMK over like here and there then we have parties like BJP which are like strong nationalists so tamilnad has got all kinds of political characters unlike Karnataka existing in one state in Italian shifting from here to there so it's a very complex state in fact when the Sri Lankan Easter bombing happened also people say the the the the help and the planning went from tamilnadu that is


and the planning went from tamilnadu that is why Naya picked up a lot of people from coimbatore at that point of time I really don't know Madam but having said that as a ex cop and somebody tells me this is an issue and this is a serious issue my job is to listen to them and maintain that precaution so what is your view on PFI should it be banned shouldn't it be banned uh is there scope for uh strong uh ideological uh parties to exist and PFA has been very consistent in the way it has been behaving after over many years in fact I was of the opinion since we are very close to Kerala I keep seeing what is happening in Kerala day in and day out it is like a free-for-all they just come every month they hack on bjpk just hack them in a broad daylight throw him away and walk out it is like you just cannot see this in a civilized society so the BAM on PF is 100 right because they